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In this thread we will be able to talk about another Petubers flaws. We will started with the basic kit of narcissistic self involved characters such as:
-She is mention now and then on TND thread, however it wasnt until recent events she make a Tweet about Lolcow and how Anons dont have anything better to do than criticizes her when she showed she spent a reasonable amount of time lurking on TND thread's.
-She throws shade to Taylor on Twitter but acts all friendly on her comments.
- When Emzotic's bf made a video making fun of Tyler Rugge and TND, she backstab him justifying she didnt dictate what he does and she actually supports both of them (Tyler and Taylor) , even tho before the video was release she tweet how proud she was of her bf.
- She upload a video of her putting together one male betta and one female betta on one tank
-He hoards animals and likes to buy the trending animal of the month.
-Had a betta fish on a fluvial tank but it "disappear". Didnt give a single shit what happen to it.
- Hoards, breed and sell a shit tons of reptiles
- Keep them on little platic containers, justifying they like it that way.
-Doesnt care if it is inbreeding.
-He sells bad quality reptiles
-He bullies costumers if they dare to call him out for the shitty conditions his animals have when they arrived
-Tyler Rugge and Taylor Nicole Dean make a collab with him
- And moreee
Taylor Nicole Dean thread: >>478685
We will make the list bigger since non of this cows have enough milk to have a thread for themselves.
However we will try to keep this thread involved to Taylor's one. Posting eachothers thread so it doesnt get lost.
Sorry if i did it wrong, there was already a thread but couldnt find it.
Sorry for bad english btw.
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I'm not an animal expert but for what I have seen, breeding Bettas is way more complicated than throwing them in the tank and hope for the best. I really think Emzotic thought it was a good idea to puts those Betta together in daily basis until a lot of fans start calling her out and she switched to "just for breeding purposes"
The male Betta didn't even have nest ready wtf.
Agreed. truly think she just had them cohabbed together with no intention of breeding, and only then said "i'm breeding" when she got called on her bullshit. Couldn't have just admitted she made a mistake, corrected her setup, and apologized? nope had to backpedal and say "breeding" even though that is NOT a proper breeding setup.
Not to mention, isn't one of them from a pet store? She should not be breeding pet-store bettas.
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What Emzotic did to those bettas is actually quite cruel. She admits the the flow in the tank prevents the male from building a bubble nest, but she STILL keeps a female in there with him. That's like putting two fertile, horny teens in a room and telling them "Don't touch!". Neither of them can do the thing that nature is telling them they NEED to do. Worse, they can't even get away from each other. It's no wonder they both look stressed and their fins have gotten worse rather than better.
Included an image to show that while the female had a few rips in her fins at the start, they worsened quite a bit after a month of supposed "healing". The male's fins seemed really good early on, but his caudal fin is ripped to hell now. Possibly self-inflicted b/c, you know, horny dude with no outlet.
Incredibly poor care from someone I thought would know better or at LEAST know to do proper research. Instead, Em made up this completely transparent "My bettas are together for breeding" cover. It's such a blatant lie that I'd be embarrassed for her if I weren't so annoyed.
Stupidly long list of everything wrong in Em's vid:
- Her tank would need to be the opposite of what it is in pretty much EVERY way to be suitable for betta breeding. She'd need a low flow, bare-bottom tank with a sponge filter and the water level about half as deep as it is. Her current flow would blow eggs EVERYWHERE and the naked filter intake is a total fry killer. This isn't hidden information. A 10 second YT or Google search would have led her straight to it.
- BEC, but her scape was terrible. You use height in the BACK to create depth. If you make the foreground high, the whole thing just ends up looking flat.
- She calls the white cylindrical tubes "concrete blocks". They're ceramic filter media/ceramic rings. Important detail if you want your subs to follow your "great" example.
- Danny and Em both claimed cycled tank WATER harbors enough beneficial bacteria to cycle a tank. BB lives on and in surfaces like filter media, sponges, substrate, and wood. It doesn't just stay suspended in the water column. Taking dirty water from the old tank is pointless.
- Tanks do not fully cycle in 2 days. Even with a proper jump start that uses cycled filter media from an established tank it takes about 1-2 weeks.
- That current MIGHT have been okay for a single betta, but the fact that it cuts straight through the middle of the tank and interferes with the female getting away from the male and vise-versa is just stupid. They're already frustrated by the fact that they can't mate so why make it harder for them to swim freely on top of it all?
- She called them "blood worms", but I'm pretty sure they're blackworms. Unlike Em, I'm happy to be corrected if someone knows differently.
- Otocinclus should be kept in groups, not solo. In any case, that tank is far too small to house them.
- Isn't Danny supposed to be the one with fish knowledge? Why didn't he correct any of her glaring errors? And anyone catch the disdain he has for Em's fans when he dropped that "sadly, that piece of wood is probably older than most of our viewers" line?
- The MOST annoying thing is how smug she was, acting like she was giving out top tier insider information when in fact she was spouting total B.S. I'm usually thrilled when people put their fish in larger tanks, but those bettas would have been much better off in smaller individual set-ups.
Now she's lying to save face at the expense of not just HER fish, but every betta pair that get tossed in a tank as a result of people following her garbage example.
Just gotta say Em really had me fooled. I actually believed her when she said she's always open to learning new information and making adjustments as needed. Still, I really hope she fixes this and houses those bettas properly.
Fellow fishfag here.
You are spot on… but how many of her followers know this stuff? Fish are among the worst treated pets, up there with rabbits. People don't give a shit about these animals because they're not as personable as dogs or cats. It's sad because rabbits have very delicate digestive systems and fish require really ideal living conditions to thrive. I'd say those two are very advanced animals to keep yet they're at the hands of newbie petkeepers.
I used to like Em but I unsubbed after seeing the betta video. Her setup had me fuming. No wonder she's sucking up to TND, they're both hoarding. She seemed to be better at this stuff before she moved in with that trashy bf of hers. Does she even work with wildlife anymore? It seems like she quit her job to be a YouTube NEET. Also kek at that wild bird she got from a pet store, all the while spewing the kinda bullshit TND says when she buys pets from cruel places.
I haven't kept doves or ferrets (though I've kept various parrots, cats, and a dog) but it sounds weird to keep a predator and prey in the same room like that. They're in cages where they can see each other which would most likely stress a rabbit the fuck out for instance. She says she lets the ferrets roam the room pretty often as well. Does it make sense to keep ferrets with the doves? That has always bugged me.
I understand wanting to surround oneself with lots of animals. I do. But these are living beings that deserve your 100%. When you think about them like small children, which is how important your pet should be to you, having upwards of 5 and pretending you can give them what they need… dunno man. I don't buy all that shit.
She is just as passive-agressive on YouTube like TND on Twitter
Liking the comments where people are telling her what she did wrong (in a really kind way) and instead of admit she fuck up she just keep making up excuses
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Some males never produce bubble nests. The caudal fin isn’t ripped you can tell by the brightening of colors they’re fine, the female looks eh but it’s hard to say because they looked really destroyed in the original pics, so it is an improvement. It took my rescue Betta almost 6mo to fully heal.
The flow should be changed but she seems to be working on that.
You don’t need that setup to breed. She can breed with what she has going on.
The males /need/ to produce a nest to allow the fish to breed successfully. Without a nest eggs will sink and he will be unable to look after them.
If Em knew anything about betta she would have conditioned both fish first.
I've seen multiple horror stories with folks just leaving male and female together after mating (ie. leaving them overnight and checking on in the morning).
Her tank, her set up, her lack of conditioning the fish is all poor care.
In that tank her fish are stressed and eventually they will nip at each other. Not to mention breeding females shortens their lives due to the stress on their bodies. Her pair isn't special or particularly pretty (not show fish for sure)… betta are common and easy to get. Why needlessly put the female through more breeding stress (if she indeed was bred before)?
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So she removed the video, but did she remove the fish. The breeding excuse is also misinformation.
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Reading her other tweets it seems more like a 'I'm not posting any more fish vids because I'm too stubborn to fix my tank and know I'll get shat on'.
Before she took the vid down her earlier comments were 100% defending them living together, and one saying the Oto was happy on it's own.
Her excuse now is that she was breeding them and they're still fine therefore.
She's full of shit.
This is correct.
Her female doesn't even look particularly gravid, just overfed like the male.
Here's a very simple guide that you can find with 2secs of googling. Not the best but it gets the point across: https://nippyfish.net/2011/03/09/conditioning-bettas-for-breeding/
Em hasn't even done basic research. I want to find a story someone posted in my breeding group about a failed pairing where they left them for 6 hours and the female killed the male in the process.
Does it really matter that she took the video down when she's likely to carry on keeping the fish in those same conditions? I agree >>498839
. Seems like she'd rather avoid posting videos than attempt to fix the issue.
Which is weird because it's not like she lacks the funds to set up proper tanks and enclosures for these animals.
I actually saw a video of hers recommended in my feed before I saw this thread.
It was about a wild-caught hornbill that she saw in her pet shop.
Shut off that video because first she lectures about how buying wild-caught birds from stores is wrong and giving them money is voting
for those businesses to keep up that practice. BUT what does she do? She goes and buys the bird from that very store and explains it away with how she felt sorry for it and how she could raise it better. How she only paid "cost" to import the bird ($3k) and that makes it okay because the business broke even and didn't profit from it. Even though she really doesn't know that for a fact.
Double standards much? It's not as if people who buy exotic wild birds go into these stores with bad intentions. I'm sure every buyer sees depressed wild birds in the cages and thinks they can give them a better life, except with the difference that most people don't make Youtube ad revenue where $3k is a feasible sale.
Tbf she did talk to the manager/owner of the petstore and told them of the issue with buying a wild-caught bird. More than most other YouTubers did. However, she might have been better giving the bird to a rescue of some sort but she has the experience so… eh.
She did a better thing than most other Youtubers though it doesn't make it fine.
Even if she was breeding the couple didn't match, she should have investigate which colors are more convenient because with these to the result wouldn't be something above average.
Emzotic showed how stupid she can be.
The bit where she poured dirty water in the tank was laughably bad. Anyone who's done a google search for more than 2 seconds knows there's little to no bacteria in the water column that could help kick start her filter.
Not to mention her assuming it's cycled after 2 days and not testing the water. Master test kits are $35.
She could have shown it done right… a 58l (or so) tank is a really nice home for a /single/ male betta and maybe some non brightly coloured dither fish (hell she might have even been able to get away with green neon tetra's). It would have been a great looking tank and an opportunity to do fish keeping /right/. But she couldn't google, and worse, she couldn't admit to her mistakes.
You're promoting misinformation. Focus on getting your facts straight instead of stanning. It's possible to like someone a LOT and still acknowledge they're fallible.
Both fish are worse off than when they started, esp the male. His caudal fin ("tail" fin) is frayed AF so I don't know what you're looking at when you say it isn't. He's not a crowntail. It's not normal for the tips of his caudal fin to be splayed.
Sorry it took half a year for your betta to get back to normal, but it's great he's there now! With frequent water changes and access to high qual food, it IS possible to see lots of regrowth very quickly. Check out Rachel O'Leary's "Clean Water is magical" vid and compare it with "They sent the wrong fish!". She saw noticeable regrowth in just a week. Subsequent footage of the bettas show how effective daily water changes, good food, and a calm environment can be.
And no, Em can't "breed with what she has going on". Her current set up is stressful AF for the parents and absolute murder on fry. The male NEEDS to be able to make a nest to show he is ready to breed and properly oxygenate the eggs. The water level needs to be lowered so he doesn't exhaust himself picking up eggs that fall to the floor. Emzotic's set up = eggs and fry blowing around the tank and being sucked into that naked filter intake. Even if, through some miracle, Em managed to breed the bettas in that tank, her way of going about it would not meet ANYONE's definition of "best practices". NVM the fact that you don't ever want to keep a male and female betta splendens together long-term. Co-ed betta set ups only work with certain wild species. Even then, you often see stressed behavior and nipped fins. >>498794
is right on about nests, btw.
& it's good that Em took the vid down. Wish it had been her own decision rather than mounting pressure from her "Creature Crew". Wish even more she had done the half hour of research it would have taken to make a video that wasn't full of BS.
Maybe this will help her realize she has a higher percentage of viewers who actually know something about animal husbandry. Means she can't get away with shit like TND or Rugge because she's already established herself as someone with years of experience and knowledge. She can't hide behind cute memes, "quirky" behavior, or lies. Since the usual PetTuber strat won't work for her, maybe she should work toward regaining trust and being the kind of person people mistook her for prior to this: honest, competent, and caring.
Seriously? Gross. I hadn't seen that, no. Didn't she JUST cop to the fact that she pretty much knows fuckall about aquatics?
Then again, ignorance has never stopped a pet YTer before.
It may have been on youtube because I can't seem to find it on twitter. But yes she said something along the lines of "They are together for breeding purposes and I will be making a follow up video on how to breed bettas".
Which is why I think she's a know it all who can't take criticism.
I feel like Em started with good intentions and husbandry. In her race to stay relevant with TND shes been cutting corners with care/research. Her blind eye approach to Taylor's animal care was enough for me to unsub.
Taylor, Brain, and Em all need to understand the amount of new reptile/aquatic people they are bring into these hobbies. The bad animal care they show on their channels just trickles down to all their followers.
I'm like 1 min into the video and I counted >15 angel fish in his 75g. Already overstocked even though most aren't max size.
Shifting the gravel around like that… releasing it all into the water. A+ way to shock your fish. Why doesn't this guy use a gravel siphon?
….. Randomly mixing returning water with no temperature control what so ever… just hoping for the best… I don't know if I can watch any more. I know it gets worse…
Please tell me he didn't start with all those angel fry and this is all that's left; that would be so depressing.
Sage your posts in future unless they contain milk/content.
Type sage in the email field.
Her content is more engaging than Taylor's at least. Taylor at least tries to interject humor to make it interesting, but it's obvious she doesn't rehearse or think about what she is going to say so her videos are all over the place and disorganized (the recent video on pitbulls in a good example, she just made vague statements and repeated herself five different ways.)
Em's presentation with her regular videos showcasing animals she works with are slow and boring, but at least the information is there in a digestible way.
So Taylor needs to work on her actual video production and Em needs to work on projecting some kind of personality.
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More inappropriate handling of animals to take nice photos, very Taylor Nicole Dean!
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She has fixed her tank and moved the female to live with the kids? Would there be babies already?
The female Betta? Because females cant be with the babies because they will eat them.
I feel Em is trying so hard to look like TND when she puts the animals in her face Kek
There wouldn't be babies, no. I think she's trying to say she gave the fish back to the previous owner whom she mentioned had used her for breeding.
I really hope the female is not "with the kids". The vast majority of female bettas have no maternal instinct, will eat eggs and fry as well as harass larger young.
jfc. It takes MINUTES to learn this shit if you even halfway try. Is she doing it wrong on purpose because she actually LIKES the drama?
All this, PLUS she exploited a rape support group to have them absolve her of that torture porn role in Human Centipede 2. She's really good at faking being a nice person.
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I thought that too at first but going by the position of her hair and that in the top right you can see the painting she has on the wall in her animal room she is standing but hey it's ok cause the crab is holding on
lol What. I mean I don't think it's necessarily better she gave it back to whatever piss poor breeder gave it her in the first place.
You're not poor… you have a decent amount of youtube money.
BUY ANOTHER TANK. Both for your female and for the Ottos and find a peaceful noncolourful nano schooling fish to go with the male (if anything). >>500538
She's standing. Can you imagine a person posing with a timer for a picture while they try to balance a crab on their fingers and over their mouth?
What a bimbo.
Emzotic wasn't like this before she moved in with that guy. She would only show her pets if they're feeling sociable. She wouldn't mishandle any of them, would avoid annoying her less social animals. Her speech seemed to be more geared towards a younger audience as well. Her channel felt simple but educational.
The TND-centric hoarding trend ruined her I guess? Or her bf's influence? She's an adult so her own shitty choices shouldn't be put on someone else's shoulders but… honestly she used to be better at this stuff.
afroherpkeeper is awesome. He's kind of a dweeby kid but he's so sincere. He also seems open to feedback which is a huge plus, esp considering his age. You end up learning new things from him which is great!
Good guy, though I don't watch every single video because I'm not really big on herp husbandry.
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Leeches disgust me. I'd rather not have a worm like creature attach itself and start ingestingg my blood.. I can't imagine why someone would purposely get one and feed it without hesitation. It doesn't seem normal to keep a pet that has to feed off of you. I understand it's only every couple of months but still. Also, from all the sources I've seen, there is no outstanding medical evidence that suggests humans have any positive response to leeches feeding off of them.
Is she using this as bait for more/continuous attention?
Yep. Pretty sure it's only going to escalate from here.
She's trying to gain notoriety, and what better way than to be the OUTRAGEOUS petkeeper who lets pet leeches feed off of her? She's totally going for an "OMGomg!1!!!!that's CrAzzEE and WYLD! She must be SUCH an interesting person to do something like that! Wait, AND she's an actress and singer too?" reaction.
This cements my belief that she's just doing all of it as a way jumpstart her other ambitions. I wouldn't give a damn if she wasn't exploiting her animals to do it.
Now that she's seen her irresponsible care grabs attention more effectively than her other methods, I'm sure we're going to see more "male and female bettas are great tankmates!" and "dirty tank water can cycle a new tank in two days!" level stupidity coupled and the weak ass lies to excuse herself afterward.
Where did she get this one from, I hope she didn't pick it up from 'the wild'. Although rare, they can and do carry diseases that have the potential to be spread to the next thing they feed on.
Either way, this is just for the shock value; sadly it's been done before https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFssw7WGJNE
Same way she'll keep this one. Tub of water. Stick her arm in to feed them and have them all attach, and then pull it out for the shock value.
FYI this will ruin her arm over time, she'll always have cuts/bruises etc due to the leech bites.
Honestly… leeches don't make good pets at all, full stop. Some animals should just be kept in the wild. I know there are medicinal uses for leeches… but again, they're not pets.
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Article from her acting gig in the human centipede 2. She met her boyfriend on this set where he provided the centipedes. I guess that is when her new "animal educator" acting role began. https://www.google.com/amp/horrornews.net/43082/interview-emma-lock-the-human-centipede-2/amp/
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I think she bought these leeches bc Ariawesomeness a very large pet instagram account recently got leeches that feed off him and they cause a LOT of drama on his page
Ari's instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ariawesomeness/?hl=en
As if they actually fucking name leeches… how does one even tell them apart?
Jesus Christ this whole thing is a mess.
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Unfortunately yes Ari does let them feed off him I wont post the full photo here bc of blood/gore. But if you go ahead and swipe through these photos you can see them very much so latched and feeding off him.https://www.instagram.com/p/BdO9vVWh-Dd/?hl=en&taken-by=ariawesomeness
I guess theres medical benefits if they are captive breed leeches that are checked to not have parasites, but prob not my cup of tea. Ari has a lot of care issues and tho he is nice to people when they give him husbandry suggestions, I've seen little change to fix those problems through the years. He still takes many risky photos and keeps predator/pray in close proximity for photos.
It's unusual but if someone is interested in leaches as animals I can see why they might want to keep them. That said I'm not sure why anyone would need to feed them their own blood, as far as I know they don't exclusively feed on humans so I feel like you could throw them some meat or feeder fish or something and be fine.
From what I understand they are still occasionally used medicinally in order to stimulate blood flow to delicate body parts that had to be surgically reattached. So while the stuff about them filtering toxins is a myth they do have a legitimate use.
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For anyone interested in the full image (NSFL), here it is. And yeah, leeches are still used to remove congested blood. They don't have any medical benefits and just because something's been around for hundreds of years doesn't mean it's good or scientifically proven.
I don't watch Happy Tails often, but something came up today that I just can't let go. She purposefully bred mixed breed dogs. Her corgi litter was the result of a purebred mom, and a mixed breed corgi (cardigan x pembroke) dad. In her exact words, "this is what is called a designer breed and they are very very popular right now." This literally makes my blood BOIL. I have no problem with breeding dogs IF they have health testing, they are being bred for purpose (herding, working, etc..), they have clear health throughout their pedigree, and they are being either shown or the parents are doing what they are supposed to be doing. With that being said, upon delving deeper, the parents of her puppies were NOT health tested before breeding and she does not show NOR breed for purpose.
also why does he use so many leeches?
I agree with most everything you said but i just wanted to note that she had homes for all the puppies before they were even born so it wasn't like she was breeding these dogs and then charging people for them or throwing them into a shelter when she couldnt find them homes>>502241
Those are the 3 leaches he owns he's not using them for a specific purpose other than feeding them
In that regard it may be true,but yes as far as detoxifying blood, which was what they were used for hundreds of years ago, it's s complete myth.>>501998
Exactly. Emma and any others who own leeches as "pets" and let them feed off of themselves for the sole purpose of feeding said leech, is just going to extremes.
From experience I can say that sometimes it is better to get a new puppy/re-home a dog from a similar situation rather than adopting. Some shelters have strict rules on the lifestyle of the owner - for example working so many hours, living in such and such space because they want the best for their dogs. This is especially seen in shelters specialising in a certain breed/mix.
I don't think we should be slating them for adoption so quickly despite the whole move being very dumb (especially if no health tests were done).
As a general rule for me, any Youtuber who proudly claims to own 50 animals (let alone a person in their teens or twenties with no real experience) is someone I stay far away from. I saw one of her videos six months ago and never went back. Glad to know her care and opinions are as ridiculous as I’d imagine>>502526
God, Maddie is so insufferable. Tyler is annoying in the respect that he pretends to have an opinion when really it’s just this vague rephrasing of something he heard from someone else (like getting triggered
over Logan Paul’s fake service dog but also clearly not understanding how that system works so it’s clear he has no investment in the topic, or saying “just Google it, it’s really bad” in his video where HE was supposed to explain to his viewers why buying animals from chain pet stores is bad)
Maddie is so smug in her opinions (wether they’re actually good opinions or not) and her “I’m right you’re wrong” undertone is so overbearing. They guest each other on younow sometimes and if I can barely stand Tyler I can barely stand the two of them together.
Agreed, I've tried to adopt dogs from shelters before but a lot of reputable shelters won't home to people with kids under the age of about 4, small animals, anyone that works more than 4 hours a day or anyone with a certain sized garden etc etc so sometimes it is easier (whether its better or not is debateable) to get dogs from breeders, because adoption centers are very picky about who they home to (rightfully so)
I think calling her a backyard breeder is a bit harsh, to me backyard breeders breed mass amounts of dogs for profit, usually in terrible conditions, does this make what she did right? No, but I still hate how they came for her and are attacking her on twitter when a lot of people in the hobby will just breed any two bearded dragons they have together with no known background or anything they will just do it because they want to
Oh yeah for sure it's definitely sketchy! I just feel like tyler and Maddie are the type to shit on anyone who gets a dog from a breeder, even if its a reputable breeder, because thats the 'correct' thing to say for asspats.
100% think adopting is the best option out there if it's possible, but I've seen so many people get attacked on the internet for getting dogs from breeders, but if everyone continues to get dogs ONLY from shelters, hypothetically there will end up being no dogs left
I think it's weird that Maddie approached the situation with genuine concern on knowing Meghan's side and was immediately attacked.
Maddie also has a dog from a breeder, though… she's talked a lot about responsible breeding on her live streams and how buying from a breeder isn't bad as long as you know you're getting a dog from a reputable breeder.
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I just CAN'T believe how rude she is to people. I was looking through her comment section and she's an absolute jerk to everyone, even people trying to help.
Even just not responding would be better.
She must forget that these are the people who depend on how her channel does, and she's definitely not doing herself any good by being a total asshole to her supporters.
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"It's non-toxic" is her excuse.
It still produces awful fumes that her animals shouldn't be exposed to.
the other option is to kill it for some places. For most dogs 4 hours is nuts, unless its a young puppy or a dog with bad isolation stress/separation anxiety. A lot of dogs are given up for isolation stress>>502327
There is no concrete term for backyard breeding but I'd say she fits the bill at least for my definition. One of the most important things to me for a breeder is that the breeder has a sincere purpose or goal for breeding, no matter how small, to better the breed/mix/designer dogs/what have you. From what I can tell, she bred her dog with very little prior knowledge, had no outcome in mind except to make videos and have cute puppies. Horrible person for people to look up to>>502461
shit happens, even responsible breeders can not make that claim and an adult would understand that. you can take precautions but you can't know for sure where these dogs will end up. and having healthy merles means fuck all when those merles can go out to create hidden merles or worse, double merles.>>502545
there are plenty of shelters that have next to no rules, and as far as brick-and-mortar shelters go they are in the majority. i will agree that shelters have dogs with unknown backgrounds and therefore iffy personalities, but honestly back yard breeders are the same. For example, if you're breeding with little discrimination and breed a genetically stranger aggressive papillon to another papillon, the puppies have a chance of being stranger aggressive despite the breed standard being the opposite. If you want a dog with a known disposition, an actual reputable breeder or an adult dog in foster home (maybe adult dog rehomed on CL if you're very trusting) would be the best routes, not a back yard breeder mixing mutts.>>502629
What you call back yard breeder is literally a puppy mill. Even back yard breeders in the end have a hard time making a profit when all is said and done. I know fuck all about herps but I know enough about mammals to know that what she did was extremely irresponsible and no one should be taking her as a good example, yet many people do look up to her. Just because other people also do bad things doesn't make it better.
Very well said, all of it.
If we're going by the Wikipedia definition of backyard breeder: "Backyard breeder is a term used to describe amateur animal breeders whose breeding is considered substandard, with little or misguided effort towards ethical, selective breeding."
She fits the bill all the way. In her video she said something along the lines of wanting to breed cardigan x pembroke to get the merle coloring. No good breeder just breeds for color. She basically said "f*ck having purebreds, I want the pretty colors."
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Pretty heartless thing to say back to someone.
I think it's a pretty valid question.
I also don't see why everyone has to register their pet as an emotional support animal though. You pet can emotionally support you without being registered.
I mean, ESA are beneficial to people wiyh anxiety in certain situations (planes, cars, etc.) and those things aren’t necessarily easy to treat with therapy. They might lessen but it’ll sort of always been there if it’s deep seated enough.
But it should be specifically kept to dogs. The people touting emotional support ducks and turkeys and hamsters and the media thinking it’s quirky and cute and not just someone who doesn’t want to put their animal in cargo or find other accommodations are where the problem continues to spiral out of control.
AntsCanada is really good. It's very hard to keep natural vivariums in perfect condition with so many insects. Most terrariums that are planted go through a 1-6month mold cycle of growing new plants mold and bugs. It you can work with the vivarium to get it past that point then you are doing good.
As a person that works with a large variety of viv setups I appreciate his transparency in the problems that are faced in this hobby. Fells nice to have updates on every colony every week even if a colony is doing very badly. I don't remember a time there was drama about him not showing a viv.
Hopping Hammy is a great channel. She makes HUUUUUGE enclosures (biggest I have ever seen) for one hamster. All her hamsters are adopted and she waits till one or two live out their lives before adopting a new one.
Another good one is lifewithpets. She came up with great quality betta dividers that are a positive adition to the hobby. She provides people with solid betta care info.
Yes, her dad is Chinese and she lived in Hong Kong for many years as a child.>>503772
I like Imee's World personally. She has rats and a mouse and makes many informative animal videos. She also takes criticism quite well and seems to give her animals quality care from what I've seen. Emma Lynne Sampson has a huge enclosure for her hamster as far as PetTubers that go above and beyond, but unfortunately she seems to hoard, and I don't watch her apart from a few videos in the past so I can't say what her reptile enclosures look like off the top of my head. Her hamster enclosure is really nice though.
I totally lost interest in the chick when she made a video being all sad like “I’m not TND… I’m just…. me :(“
Not saying TND is the first person who started this annoying trend but she does all the same attention grabbing shit that TND does, posing with her animals but doing her hair and makeup excessively so it’s obvious she wants to be the focus, etc. Shes just an equally as uninteresting TND
There’s also HoppyHammy like people have mentioned before. One of her cages is two 50 gallons that she fashioned together which is pretty cool.
ErinsAnimals is also pretty amazing, because not only are here enclosures huge but she custom builds them herself.
VHH’s channel is the cutest thing. I’m a bit sad though because she posted a video with Vanilla celebrating his 2nd birthday within the last few months so I know time I short for the little guy. I’m not gonna be ready when he goes.
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Happy Tails is now going to start charging people for pet care advise?? Who would pay her for her false information. It's so annoying how she acts like she's an expert when she probably has the worse pet care out of all the pet youtubers I've seen.
1 dollar per minute? What in the hell.
Most 'good' consultations last 10-15 minutes, who ever pays her is a complete idiot as you could get the same info from google but it is also EXPENSIVE.
all I remember from him was how he said wet dog food can give blueys mouth rot and immediately stopped watching lol
I kinda dislike people making care sheets for animals on YouTube as they have to keep them short to keep people's short attention spans and therefore are usually all over the place and laced in false information
especially when they have either only had the reptile for under a year or don't state that they're not good for your only source of information
Holy fuck if her advice is worth $1 a minute mine is worth $10 a syllable.
She is the one youtuber who I honest to god can not understand how she can even keep up adequate care of all of her animals. The ferrets are recommended to have at the very least an hour or two of floor time a day, and guinea pigs should get an hour a day as well or close to it. Rats need a lot of time outside of the cage daily. And she has a ton of high maintenance birds. That's not even counting her farm animals.
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My favorite thing about how obviously materialistic and skindeep Tyler is with his love for animals is every time someone asks him in his younows about what he thinks about xyz animal, his repose is always
>those are cool>those are cute>I want one :)
But never elaborates ever. Not asking for a dissertation but at least act like you care
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Did she keep two puppies? Has she never heard of littermate syndrome? And wouldn't the more logical thing to do if you can't afford to get another sugar glider be to get rid of your remaining one, especially when you have 70+ other animals to take care of?>>504907
No, her job is blogging and being a youtube personality. As far as I can tell she has no related education or other credentials.>>504914
People pay her a lot more for a lot less, pic related
In the video she made about which puppies she’s keeping she said she’s keeping 3. I don’t know if that has changed since then though.
What I don’t get is how she can afford to take care of all of her animals but she can’t afford $600 for a sugar glider. Makes you wonder whether she really can afford to take care of them.
So I follow Steff J, I am not a fan, I like her attitude but she is straight hoarder it wasn't until recently i realize she a danger for her pets. https://youtu.be/HJTjrgAZ190
She kill all her fish (even salt water) with poison for fleas.
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(Checking her website now)
> Sells a sweatshirt with “animal lover” on it > Sells bracelets made out of YAK BONES
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Excuse me, I was mistaken:
They’re made out of Yak Bones
Ugh yeah I was going to mention her earlier. Her house looks dirty af, along with her back yard. She had those turtles too that laid eggs outside because she wasn't watching them and then half the eggs got eaten by ants and shit and one of the few she was able to hatch had a birth defect where its shell didn't form so she just soaked them all in broth?? How about don't let your turtles breed. There are enough invasive turtles around.
I think I was done with her though when she got those puppies given to her as a present and then kept them both despite saying she didn't want dogs…
Honestly I try to avoid her videos; her living situation makes me feel dirty from across the screen.
Have her starfish died yet? Did the flea treatment kill them? Honestly I don't know if I want to watch that vid.
I thought the eggs that got eaten by ants where lay by "stray" turtles which weren't hers.
I think the star die already. I didn't thought the mistake was that stupid until she said when the seller said the powder was "pet friendly" she include tank pets
You don't need anyone to tell you that shit will kill your fish, it is common sense
I didn't quite understand her lame ass excuse about not bathing the kitten because it was cold but, her house doesn't have a heater, warm water, a blow dryer??
She was just lazy and if doesn't any of those things maybe she should fucking have so many pets.
People were bringing up hoarding so I thought I'd make a tally of HappyTails' animals, since for some reason she didn't have a tally like most pet youtubers do. Then I found out why not, she literally can't count them all.
>7 horses that are just boarded there
>service dog white GSD
>blue merle cardigan/pembroke corgi
>9 mutt puppies, 3 that she's keeping
>2 male crested geckos
>giant day gecko
>2 bearded dragons
>banana ball python
>2 prairie dogs
>2 guinea pigs
>60 gallon with 'a few' plecos, glowfish, some mollys, some fancy tail guppies, betta, and ghost knife fish
>15 gallon tank with ~10ish neon tetras, ~10ish guppies, a betta, some shrimp
>rose breasted cockatoo
>2 green cheek conures
>2 cats, 'lynx point siamese' and 'calico ragdoll'
>1 Juliana pig
>2 sugar gliders
>2 miniature horses
>~20 guinea hens
>~20-30 assorted chickens
>a ton of peacocks
>too many homing pigeons to count
Does she live alone or on some kind of fucking ranch?
I have THREE ANIMALS and it takes time to care for them and keep everything clean and happy. I'd have never ending anxiety if I owned that many fucking animals, does she have vet emergency money set away for each of them?? Does she spend every waking minute cleaning tanks and terrariums? What the fuck
She has a husband and a part time job, and despite having a husband I will assume that she lives on a ranch with her parents, or someone's parents. Even for 4 people, one of whom has a full time job and the other a part time job, that's a lot of animals to take care of. She did say that the only animals that were not hers were the 7 boarded horses and one bearded dragon that was her husbands, everything else I am assuming is hers. She has no money and is actually begging online for people to donate to her so she can buy another sugar glider.>>509109
There's no fucking way she can, she even admits she has no idea how many birds she has and she says she lets them free roam. In other words, the birds aren't contained in any fashion and can run off and never come back. She would never even know if one went missing to go out and search for it. She also had an accidental litters with her goats from her other (not accidental?) litters of last year.
Pickles seemed nice and I really felt bad about the type of comments she got for her looks or her lisp (HammyLux has a lisp and no one ever says anything about that, is it because she’s conventionally more attractive?)
But once Pickles started vlogging about going to expos and getting all those gecks I started to check out.
I haven’t called anyone a hoarder
(other than Happy Tails) but I’m in agreement that most of the pet youtubers are hoarding
animals, since the definition of hoarding to me is “taking much more than you need or could use.” These spoiled brat white kids still living with their parents don’t need
to take in animals that could quite possibly outlive them (re: Tyler’s African Grey), or a rare exotic fish (re: Cheese), or fifteen snakes when two years ago you’ve had zero experience with snakes (re: Taylor)
But they do it anyway because “oooooh pretty.” None of them have even thought about the possibility of “oh hey, if I have kids one day… some of these animals might not be safest… oh hey if I need to move, I probably won’t be able to take half of these animals with me.”
hoarding pets and textbook 'hoarder' is different, anon. many of these pet youtubers have more pets than foster pet parents do, and the youtubers pets are permanent.>>510725
I think the sorry state of other pet youtubers if fooling you into thinking large amounts of animals is normal.
Most people would have 1-3 reptiles if they kept them. Only breeding operations tend to have more.
Ordinary people with 10+ reptiles are stretching themselves thin, it's not normal.
I think it's really a stretch to be saying something isn't "normal" here.
Like it was stated before, if the animals are being cared for in proper enclosures, how is this considered hoarding animals?
A lot of these YouTubers, they are home with their animals all day and at least should be researching what they get before they get it and providing proper care so they don't spread false information. Happy Tails, definitely an animal hoarder. Pickles? Not an animal hoarder. >>510725
Let's be clear here, you're saying people shouldn't adopt birds? Tyler is young and he got a bird, if anyone else adopted the bird, would that have been wrong because the bird could potentially outlive them? I don't get what you're saying here. As long as he commits to the continued care of the bird as long as he lives, how is adopting a long lived bird a problem when he is young and in good health?
I was the original anon who said this. I don't think there is anything wrong with having a lot of pets. I don't think if you have 30 you're automatically a hoarder or anything like that. My parents have 100 head on their farm and with the size of their range, it's far from overstocked. And I know many here keepers that do amazing jobs.
I'm only iffy about some people's mentality about getting pets. Pickles has been doing a lot of impulse shopping recently and the frequency she gets new species is concerning to me. I don't think she knows what she is doing, and she needs to stop and learn a bit about the creatures she has before impulse "rescuing" 3 lizards from craigslist.
After the whole TND thing went down I noticed that I have similar impulsive patterns with animals. I've got 7 animals now and they're all in good health, but the ways and reasons I went about buying them weren't good. And the time frame either. Examples of things: Spending hours a day on craigslist when work had to be done, ignoring enrichment in favour of new animals, putting pet supplies before human supplies, etc.
Went to a therapist and yeah, I've learned a lot about hoarding and the many different reasons it manifests. Small things in my life trigger
it and I'm building up coping mechanisms so that if something bad happens it won't take over my life TND style.
Blah, blah, blah, I'm blogging here at this point. But basically Pickles husbandry is worrying me and her speed of getting new animals. That's it.
To make it clear, I get that reptile keeping can be a hobby but it's still not a usual one perhaps I should have added that with 'breeders'.
However most people who keep reptiles still do not keep them as a hobby or keep 10+ of them. ergo it's not 'normal'.
The pet youtubers all mentioned here for the most part go beyond 'hobby' anyway and they do often impulse buy animals. I don't know what else you could call that but hoarding.
I worked in an lps in high school and I had plenty of herp hobbyists come in with 15+ reptiles. If a normal person heard someone had that many pets they'd think it isn't normal, but in the herp community it is relatively common. Just go to any snake forum and you'll see a good portion who have over a dozen reptiles.
The thing that makes me think a lot of these YouTubers are hoarders though is of course the impulse buying without research, and improper care, but also the huge variety of animals they have. It's not normal to me to have at the same time birds, small animals, reptiles, saltwater and freshwater fish, dogs, cats, turtles, etc. Most hobbyists with a lot of animals focus on fish or reptiles, which I think are the only types of pets you can have in large numbers and still keep well. When you add a huge variety of mammals and birds in there that need a lot more time and attention (and a lot of times a lot of space in comparison to their body size), that's when it definitely starts to feel like hoarding to me.
Again, you’re putting words in my mouth.
I’m brought up the bird’s long lifespan for the obvious
reason that Tyler is 20-21, still lives at home with his parents, doesn’t seem to be dating anyone (unless he and Maddie are dating?), and he hasn’t said anything about school or a job outside of Youtube.
Now for the rest of his life, he has to adjust his lifestyle and schedule to that bird. It’s no skin off my bones he can do whatever he wants, I’m just saying it’s totally impulsive.
Also I used him as part of multiple examples of ridiculous pet youtubers to show they’re all ridiculously impulsive and you only seem to be triggered
over my opinion of Tyler. I don’t think it’s smart. Get over it.
In the last few months she started cheering away from strictly hamster stuff into getting some geckos and skinks and going to reptile expos. But her behavior hasn’t been that concerning so I don’t think it’s that big a deal yet,
Don’t know enough about hamsters or geckos to judge her care in that department
Yeah sorry. It's your typical petco sucks story. But I get the impression he tried to get a job there just to get fired and make a click bait video about it.
Another better example of the shit he pulls. He faked a service dog just to make a point about service dogs or idk what he's doing. He pulls stunts like this all the time while condemning other people of the same type of stuff.
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Pawfessor has been around for a LOONG time trying to harass trainers. He got kicked out from both Jean Donaldson and Karen Pryor Clicker training schools.
He is mostly known for attacking trainers ..then after he becomes too much and they retaliate he deletes all comments/videos ect.. and cries online that he is the victim and encourages ppl to go attack.
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He tries to create drama for attention
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But its all a fake
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Here is the proof that he got kicked out of one of the dog training schools.
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This was after the first post where "blood was spilled"… no one gave him attention so he went on a tantrum
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He was able to grow his channel through the constant drama and when other trainers made videos about him he got more subs.. so for a while he kept baiting people.
This gave him a really bad rep..and most of his following hated him.. so he deleted almost all of his old videos and tried to restart.. but he always goes back to his old ways.
There is a secret group on fb that archived his old videos and keeps tabs on screenshots comprised of dog trainers he harassed on both sides ..reward based trainers and balanced.
Thats all I'll share for now as I don't wanna overspam you guys. There is never ending shit on him…
While I cannot comment on the paint thing it seems like the ferrets were not out running around during the time the doves were.
On another note, the painting just looked…eh. It was a cool idea but her the background would blend with the hair from further away and in general it looks like she may have been better off painting something from scratch?
I wonder how they will go around selling the dove if it hatches though.
Also, in her creature feature videos she has a very condescending voice. At first I thought it was her interest but it seems a bit scripted and like she's shouting? The tone is what really makes it sound unnatural too.
I love Erin'sAnimals! I don't really like most of the hamster youtubers though, tbh. The videos give me like "live laugh love" vibes… ErinsAnimals, AprilsAnimals, and VanillaHamHam are the only ones I can stand.
If TNT gets a hamster I'm going to be so upset
I haven't been watching Steff J's videos lately, but in the ones I have, I haven't seen anything warranting people saying that her house is dirty. She has a lot of free roaming animals, but she's also shown herself cleaning and mopping up after them, so it feels like people are just throwing that around simply because she has a lot of animals. Also, it kind of seems like people that just show off their pets aren't allowed to make mistakes. The flea powder incident was a dumb mistake on her part, but some people on here are talking about it like she dumped the flea powder directly into the tank, when she said she turned off everything and covered the tanks trying to prevent the powder getting into the tanks, and she was told it wasn't harmful to pets.
In the middle of winter, it's not a good idea to bathe sensitive baby kittens, even if the house is heated. But we don't even know her situation, other than she lives in Mexico. I can't tell you what heating systems are like, but it sounds like she did what she thought was best for the animals and it backfired. Jesus Christ. I despise TND and other pet youtubers, but it feels like because of her, there's a witch hunt on a lot of Youtubers who are actually doing trying to do their best, but have had some misfortune.
Probably going to be called a stan, but also, Emma did not ditch her animals in the UK. She petitioned to bring them into the US, but customs didn't allow it, so they're living with friends and she goes back to visit them. Jesus. There's enough that some of these people do wrong without reaching so hard for little things like this.
lol Steff J's house isn't dirty. Have you watched any of her vids? It's constantly gross in the background. Her duck shits wherever it pleases inside her house too lol I remember watching one vid where she steps in it.
Also she just put up a new vid about smuggling her chameleons from a reptile expo on a plane. A+++ Pet keeping there.
-Smuggles chameleons on plane in handbag
-Nervous as handbag goes through scanner
-Claims she would have them shipped via cargo if they caught her
-Calls them delicate and not beginner friendly while one is barely hanging on in her hair
-Houses them together despite admitting risks in that situation
-Shear amount of animals coming out of her house when she returns.
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Danny posted this on Facebook… i feel like this isn’t something to be proud of
Wtf? So he's proud that he has let loose/lost lizards in his house, and never bothered to catch them long enough for them to lay, incubate, and hatch eggs unnoticed. I can't imagine what that house smells like.
The more I see the state of Danny's animals and husbandry, the more I doubt his 'animal expertise.' Like in the betta video, if he's such an expert, why did he allow emzotic to dump dirty water from one of his tanks and let her say it was cycled water? Or tell her to use carbon in the filter? Or allow her to house two bettas in the first place?
Steff J just uploaded a new video of her manhandling a Toad, not even wearing gloves to protect its skin, but literally holding it in uncomfortable positions
And you've got the typical (usually Taylor dean phrase) of "You shouldn't really handle them often, I don't usually, but i am for the video"
Dear lord her voice is just annoying.
I see she had also rescued some kittens, interesting.
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Not exactly a YouTuber but he's been talked about so what the fuck is this? Letting anacondas freeroam?
I noticed that! She really just seemed like she was trying to be polite when he presented them, but I don't think it was good of the guy to spring turtles on her like that, and I'm glad she isn't keeping them.
Turtles and goldfish don't really mix great anyway from what I know, and goldfish are her main thing and main plans for that pond, so the guy really didn't plan that well. She's said she never gets animals without researching heavily and it took her a year or something to get bunnies and something like 5+ years to get poison frogs, so I doubt she appreciated surprise animals.
i don't remember the exchange as being akward and she didn't know when the pond was installed that red ear sliders were illegal in Florida. viewers commented on that (yt and insta) and in the next video when she updated us on the pond and everything else she mentionned that she had to give them back and why.
it's just speculation but following here for years (and yeah i like her, not saying she's perfect) i think she's the kind not to like when people "surprise" her with animals. she said she was interested in adopting a turtle or tortoise but it wasn't the right time (in another video) + she is setting up the mini patio planted thing for fishes
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hes pretty overweight which is enough evidence to say hes not properly taken care of. Not too farmiliar with him so cant say much about rumours of him being locked in a bathroom, but when hes not free roaming he should be in a big enclosure with access to a hot basking spot. Heres a healthy red tegu for comparison with his weight
I thought i was the only one who saw that. That guy seem so pushy, his only job was just build the pond and he just was…too much
Besides it wasnt fair for her, the pond was meant to be just for her gold fish and he practically obligate her to accepted the turtles( it isnt a secret turtles like to eat fishes from time to time) even if the turtles dont want to eat the fishes they wont thrive because is it a really stress full enviaronment
Was funny to watch Solid searching for any excuse to return them
Sorry 4 bad english btw
Maybe SerpaDesign ?
I haven't seen all his videos but it looks like he cares about his pets (he is a little bit weird tho but you get used to it lol)
And now of course Meghan has "adopted" two more sugar gliders even though she can't care for her animals or afford them?
Cataleah, the girl she got them from had absolutely disgusting terrariums. Totally covered in feces for most of them. Her crested gecko terrariums were under minimum. Her mossy leaf tail geckos enclosure was bare as hell when these geckos really love to hide. One of her hognoses (a burrowing snake) was on paper towel. Her knob tail gecko was in a tub with no water dish. What the actual hell.
Did anyone else notice this?!
You'd think she would've cleaned up her enclosures before knowing she was going to be filmed or another pet person was coming over.
But she does take care of her animals pretty well. Her betta is in its own 5 gallon I think and her quails have good enclosures and her dogs get good food
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Emzotic is making a leech video, posted a short video with this on Twitter.
theyre really low maintenance, kinda hard to neglect them tbh. theyre obviously not companion animals but theyre really cool to keep, far easier to keep than other aquatic animals like fish too.
now, back to what this thread is actually about. does anyone know what animals she had to leave behind in england?
First time poster here.
Keeping macaws as pets is a terrible TERRIBLE idea. They're pretty much impossible for a private owner to (properly) care for. They will almost always become destructive, aggressive and they WILL develop behavioural disorders sooner or later. They also get very VERY old. You'll basically have a high maintenance pet for the rest of the life.
Adopting two recues - that's something else. But she got hers from a breeder afaik.
She wants to breed them, too, which is just unacceptable.
I totally concede to this because I’ve always considered all large parrots to be far beyond difficult for a pet owner, I only watch her for her snakes and recently saw her discussing these birds. I thought her mention of breeding was dodgy but thought maybe it was a conservation thing. She seems to love the birds and talks about wanting to free fly them some day which sounds major risky but I am not a bird owner so maybe it’s doable idk.
Anyway yea I didn’t mean to imply I know or support any keeping of macaws I just think her snake vids are decent and knew she also keeps those birds lol
Ironically he made a video about non-sage things for birds and made another video stressing how you need to spend time with them a lot more than people think
The quarantine thing isn’t a surprise. Didn’t he get a bearded dragon that was sick that subsequently killed a few of his others?
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I've been waiting for ari to have to "rehome" his lacertas. This guy goes through animals like they're nothing.
That did happen but I think it was when he was like 16. And when did he do anything unsafe around his birds?
I honestly dont have an issue with him. He does stuff that is wrong sometimes but people usually correct him and then he changes it
I used to follow her and find her videos interesting but after she got the “wolf” I think is when I started getting sick of her. I’m no expert on wolfdogs but I know enough to know her claim he is “as close as you can get to a pure wild wolf” is absolute bullshit.
She had a complete meltdown on Facebook a while back because her Doberman got bitten by a rattlesnake and spent thousands and thousands on antivenom. She’s just really really whackadoo, and always adopting random feral dogs from other countries for some reason?
He set up a tank once and got a lot of criticism for this methods and I’m the follow up video he basically alluded to the fact that he thought the products he was using were good because he saw good reviews online about it, and another thing about not cycling properly because “this person did this and that worked for them.” Meanwhile he’s a novice fishkeeper so whatever shortcuts and cut corners other experiences keepers do is kind of irrevelant because he doesn’t even understand the basics fully
He also made one of those cliche videos “exposing” pet store chains about where the store’s animal come from but rather than explaining what the conditions the animals are bred in are like he just tells his viewers to google it. It’s your
video dude, you tell me the information
He also made this April Fools video about his snake biting him really severely which really
rubbed me the wrong way. Taylor used to do similar things with her spider, where she would go on about how they’re not scary and then use them to prank/terrify some friends for a video. But that was a whole different level because he put fake makeup and blood on and everything and kept it up for a full minute. How exactly does you pretending you got bit not feed into the stigma that snakes with attack people without warning? He’s an idiot.
That’s just some
of the shit I hate about him. He’s so vague about everything he says. “Do your research” “give them proper care” “the info I found online said…”
His care videos are also just super boring in general. Despite owning the damn animal, he can’t give specific examples of types of toys or food they like or just doesn’t care enough
It may have happened when he was 16 but he still does not quarantine, meaning it could still happen again very easily. I mean his reptiles also just had mites from not quarantining. I know multiple people have pointed out that his abronia enclosure is not adequate and he definitely hasn’t changed anything. Same with his red tail boa enclosure.
He had a candle burning in the background of his video AFTER making the video about things that are unsafe for birds, and thinks it’s okay to use non-stick cookware as long as the bird isn’t in the kitchen. He was using mite spray in his house which isn’t safe either. Any kind of spray usually isn’t safe, whether that’s air freshener, cleaners, perfume/cologne, any chemicals, anything scented in general. And definitely not nonstick cookware.
His reptile enclosures are all at least minimum, his birds are out a lot on his livestreams and I've never seen candles or sprays around their cages (they aren't in his room like the rest of his animals are) He says his rabbit comes out a lot but he mentioned on his live stream that he doesn't have a larger cage or a playmate for his rabbit is because his parents won't let him but he's apparently moving out soon and plans on upgrading then. I think he said he got his bearded dragons from a reptile shop that sold them when they were sick and he cohabbed them bc he said he didn't know any better (that's how the shop was keeping them???) and the one had yellow fungus or something and they died.
I agree to an extent, I think Emzotic disappoints me more because she used to be much better and seeing her gradual descent into “stunt” ownership (leaving animals in one country to be with her boyfriend and get MORE animals in a different country, wild caught birds, leeches, questionable handling for edgy selfies etc) in order to keep up with Taylor has been a let down
I don’t care that she was in shitty horror though. She never claimed the Family Friendly Pet Mom moniker bs (although I would say she’s lived up to it more than TND ever did) and she wanted to be an actress and took the shitty horror roles she was given. It’s not like she wrote those movies lol. But ya I can’t excuse keeping ferrets and doves so close that was always a bad choice
I agree with you about both your points, that she never claimed to say she was a pg friendly pet mom and yes she didn't write those horror movies. It is a bit unfair of me to judge her for her acting career, but I she said that she interviewed real survivors of rape in an online chat group and asked if they would object to her scene where she is raped with barbed wire and they said yes, she did it anyway. Why ask real survivors, people who went through something so terrible if you made up your mind to go through with the role no matter what they said.
Just listened to her BBC interview where she said her pet biology teacher advised her to get a baby rat which she bottle fed and kept a secret for 4 weeks from her parents. What kind of misinformed biology teacher tells his student to get just 1 rat when they must be kept at least in pairs.
I think I'm just angry because I feel so betrayed for I really liked her older videos, had respect for her until her move and the betta video.
What lol she absolutely says it hurts. She even rates the pain on a scale of 1-10. 1 when it's not grinding with it's jaws and 3 when it is. lmao although it looks like more when she's wincing and her voice goes up in pitch. I'm not saying it's unbearable agony, but she is in pain.>>529187
No, you absolutely can feel something. If you're walking through a cold pond etc. where they're in the wild, you're less likely to notice them because of reduced bloodflow due to you being cold.
She absolutely is being an edgelord though lol, which is why she used the sanitary towel after to wrap her arm.
Not to mention she literally stole someones chicks / eggs from their farm to 'save' them, even though she has enough birds on her farm already
I'm also finding it amusing how other pettubers (tyler) are turning on Happytails publicly for her videos / care, yet none of them dare confront Taylor about hers
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happytails has a blog on her website and this is her defense for back yard breeding her dogs. its basically "i like corgis and i dont wanna travel to one of many corgi recues sooo i bought some so i could breed them and always have a supply of them"
I was the same way, I used to really enjoy her videos and now it seems like it's just her trying to get the coolest and most "shocking" creature. It's a real shame.
This is hilarious to me that she said that breeders would "laugh at her" about docking their tails.
I was getting into showing Pembrokes and almost every AKC breeder I know will leave tails if asked, especially if the pup is paid for up front. As long as the person isn't showing the dog (which you have to get a contract to show usually anyway) then tails can be left intact.
It's just another stupid excuse by this moron.
Also, another thing that really annoyed me was that she set up a gofundme for her to go and adopt or buy another Sugar glider as a friend for her lone sugar glider. Could she not just have used the money from youtube for that, since it's technically money from fans views anyways?
Secondly, she ended up adopting a sugar glider from cataleah and visted her house / animal collection, but in the video she so briefly skimmed over the fact that she was even getting the sugar glider, didn't seem that excited, and hasn't spoken about it since? I feel sorry for any of her poor fans who donated to it
She even ended up getting two from Cataleah, not just one.
It just shows that she has no idea how to stop getting animals….
Theres nothing wrong with branching out and owning more than one species? Someone shouldn't be limited to owning one animal and only making videos about that animal on their channel, when its likely that when they started their channel that was the only animal they were capable of owning at the time. I wouldn't say she's a copycat, she has probably wanted to own a lot of these species for a while, and it's only because of becoming successful on youtube that she's been able to support them?
I'm sure the majority of her videos on her channel would still be fish related but thats kind of at a stand still due to all her fish getting a mysterious illness and dying and she can't get anymore until her fish room is done.
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i was watching cataleahs videos after her doing a video with happytails, remember when she said it takes forever to find them homes because she always questions the potential owners alot? lol idk about other people but id be asking about their enclosure, the diet they plan on feeding, and how much free time they have to spend with the gliders before even mentioning money
sage for no new info this is from like months ago lmao
It's ok to branch out but she seems to be a novice rabbit pet owner tbh, and doesn't listen to advice given by others about how to better care for her rabbit.
She continues to feed them iceberg lettuce which is the worst kind of lettuce due to its high water content which will eventually give them diarrhea. Bunnies should eat greens like dandelions, romaine lettuce, rucola (aragula), etc. People have commented on this since she got Henry.
She also thinks that Hengry and Ophelia bonded, but Ophelia is so young that she has not yet developed her need to dominate which can emerge when she gets older. Bunnies are very territorial.
Also she rubs me the wrong way because she promotes bad husbandry by breeding unhealthy body types and colors together. And just way over handles her fish and stresses them out needlessly.
Her videos are becoming way more about her and her lifestyle than about the pets themselves it seems.
Dude… wtf. I understand in some instances adoption isn't possible, especially if you have a full time job but buying dogs to breed for a constant supply is so fucked up.
My family spent nearly a grand in moving a dog from one country to another, mind you she wasn't a rescue but if you want a purebred dog that bad I'm pretty sure travelling won't be an issue
I couldn't believe it when HappyTails stole those chicks, even though someone kept telling her they belonged to someone else. She literally stole those chicks and is acting all mightier than thou about it.
Why is she taking care of baby chicks when she just got a new gargoyle gecko and two new sugar gliders??
Agreed. She committed a felony and should be charged for it. Maybe then when the cops come they'll call the SPCA to rescue the poor animals she's mistreating.
I'm sorry to say but people like this really make me wish there were laws about how many pets people can own at once.
>>529449>i can't find a reputable breeder>so i'm going to byb my own!
I wouldn't be even half as upset if she wasn't fucking SELLING her advice online, dumb cow. Thank the lord she's a fucking nobody and isn't semi popular like TND>>530883
I imagine, at most, she could only be charged for trespassing and whatever toe cost of the chickens she stole was, which wouldn't be a lot. While her animals are being kept in awful care for a self proclaimed animal expert, it's not bad enough for the authorities to intervene.
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But Emzotic literally has 0 animal related qualifications. She may have a lot of experience but calling her qualified is a bit of a stretch
Why is no one using sage?>>531635>>531645>>531650>>531590
Mods can you auto sage this thread?
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Just seen this, Taylor lookalike seems to have put mice in this cage? Anyone know anything about mice and whether this is ok
So Steff J just replaced all her dead fish with expensive ones including a blue tang. :/
Is it me or is she following the TND train of buying rare / expensive animals? She just bought those rare + expensive turtles too.
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Seems to be 3 in there
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It's a bit too small and slightly overcrowded, especially for 3 mice. Not too
horrible though. Would need cleaned constantly considering how overcrowded it is.
She's way too ugly to be a thot, not even her tits are good enough to attract attention. It's actually pretty sad.>>531656
Way too tiny, and if there are 3 in that, extremely tiny. You'll sometimes see mice, even female mice, kill each other if they don't have the space. If you are trying to flaunt yourself as an expert or some other authority on animals, it's far from fine. If you just want to have pet mice, then it doesn't matter.
shes shown that cage in a few of her 'pet room tour' videos and has been like "dont worry guys, nothing lives in that cage as its too small its just a travel cage'
now shes contradicting herself ok
Oh yeah i saw that, i cant bare watch her videos because she saturade the colors so much just for her ugly hair to look bright, the fishes were beautiful but you cant see them very well.
Honestly she should just stop buying pets. She is way too stupid to not understand a powder that kills flees can kill fishes.
Honestly I doubt how long those fish are going to live.
Aren't Blue Tang's supposed to be notoriously difficult to keep?
Also she just opened the bag with the box fish in allowing ammonia toxicity to spike after a long journey; and then didn't acclimatise it to the temperature of the tank water before plopping it in after a few scoops of tank water into the bag.
Oh yeah and she didn't quarantine because she bought them all around the same time and the tank wasn't mature so it didn't matter or something… smh.
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at least shes better than TND who at one point claimed "i know everything abt animals" in her video when she got her pacman frog after her first one passed
I watched her video on chinchillas and she said that grapes/raisins are toxic to them. Which is a complete load of bullshit. Yes, chinchillas should not have fresh fruit or raisins because they are high in sugar/not made for their digestive system, but that doesn't mean they are toxic to them.
I could barely handle watching her acclimate that boxfish. I like that her reasoning was if he gets too stressed, he will poison the tank and kill all the other fish. Sounds like a great fish to keep with super sensitive fish, like blue tangs and mandarin gobies.
Her justification for not quarantining them is just a bullshit excuse to be lazy. You would think that after spending all that money on the tank, corals, and exotic fish that she would care about getting the most out of her investment. Or just caring that her pets live and thrive. But that is asking a lot out of a petyoutuber.
She moved them to a bin because it was more secure. Bin cages are common, I don't see a problem with this. There's plenty of pettubers who are far more problematic
I don’t think attacking someone’s character based on what they “seem” like is necessary. There’s no evidence that she’s a b*tch, and after your comment and went to look at her channel. While she does seem to put out videos that are view grabbers, I see very few care guides and cage tours.
If we are going to be talking about problems with pettubers, we should try to make sure they’re actual problems imo. There’s some serious sh*t that happens to those animals on some of those channels that is far more important than someone you’ve picked a bone with for apparently personal reasons.
Yeah, if any of these channels started out as "youtuber who just happens to have a lot of pets" where in between regular videos they would inject pet content or maybe have their pets on livestreams with them every once and a while it would be easier to keep my attention for more than a few weeks
All of their personalities default to "lol i'm so crazy look how many pets i have lol i'm not like other kids my age" (with the exception of channels like King of DIY who clearly has a family and a job outside of YouTube and is just doing it as a hobby)
The rest of the pet youtubers are just teenage to young adult kids who are idiots trying to amass as many animals as possible. Most of them still live with their parents, so I'd love to see how easy it is for them to find a place that'll accept all of their animals once they move out (unless they can suddenly afford a house)
Why is it so hard for you guys to believe that some people just generally love animals and truly love caring for them ??
Look at makeup gurus for example… they all own shit tons of makeup and make videos to grab views but nobody’s saying that it’s just a competition to see who has the most. Clearly they just actually love makeup. Why is it so difficult to apply this to the pet community?
I’m pretty sure that owning animals is hella expensive and takes a ton of time so I highly doubt these people wouldn’t be owning them unless they actually enjoyed it
Uhh…. maybe because makeup is inanimate and animals are living breathing creatures?
Like wtf even is this comparison!?
Where the fuck did I say that they didn't love animals? Lol like I have zero idea what point you're trying to make and I don't think you know either. It just sounds like a bunch of white knighting and whining.
You realize that just about everyone in this fucking thread loves animals otherwise we wouldn't have a problem with the pet communities impulse buying and inadequate care……….right?
I’m oretty sure we all know there’s a big difference between animals and makeup.
I think the point they’re trying to say is that maybe petubers dong buy animals as some sort of “competition” maybe the buy them because they actually love them
The point asshole is that it's easy to splurge a few hundred dollars on makeup because you "like it" but one day when you don't care about it anymore you can just throw it away and it doesn't matter
Once you get an animal that's it. For the next however many years it's supposed to live (for an example if we're talking snakes most of them can live a good 40-50 years), you're stuck with that pretty much for your entire fucking life, which is a pretty dumb decision for teenagers still living with their parents and no real job to make
Time will tell who can actually care for the animals long term and who ends up living with their parents forever I guess. Nothing you can do about that.
What do you guys think about rescue/rehome? I can't think of anyone of the top of my head who work with helping sick animals and rehoming them afterwards. I think if more people did this, they could do something good and promote rescuing. However a lot of petubers probably are not qualified to do this sort of work or they would just end up keeping all of them.
Maddie Smith does a lot of rescue work and works with multiple rescues, including a wildlife rehab, in her state.
I will say though that I think it’s important to recognize the different between a PET YouTuber and an animal channel.
A lot of the people discussed here are pet channels. If you want rescue channels, you’d have to follow those. Wildlife Montana, Vet Ranch, Wildlife Aid, etc.
They’re both animal related but they are different fields.
Then get off the thread, faggot.
Hoarders and addicts "love" whatever it is they're obsessed with too, but that doesn't mean that it isn't ridiculous when it's in excess. But NO ONE fucking said that they hate animals so I don't know where any of you are pulling that statement from.
If you disagree, that's fine.
But for the love of god why would you call someone a faggot?
It does nothing for your argument at all. What a terrible excuse for an insult.
Calling someone a faggot is a great way to make anything else you say invalid.
Don’t be the loser that still thinks fag and faggot is a suitable insult.(newfaggotry)
Maddie has gone dumpster diving too and donated the unexpired food she found to feed the wild rehab raccoons i think.
Tyler donated unused dog beds he found in the dumpster to an animal shelter.
People dumpster dive all of the time, I've seen quite a few other videos of people doing it as well. Once you get over the weird stigma, people find some pretty crazy shit in there lol
it's 2018, we have so many amazing insults.
gay and faggot being used as insults can die out now.
I never said anyone in this thread hates animals. You responded directly to my comment so maybe you should reread it.
I just think it’s pretty pathetic that this thread started off with actual critiques of people doing some potentially harmful things with their animals and now it’s devolved into bullshit name calling by people like you who live in 2018 and still think “faggot” is acceptable.
“Welcome to the internet”
“You must be new here”
Those aren’t excuses to use f*ggot as an insult. Pick something else that isn’t offensive to an entire group of people, you asshole :)(newfaggotry)
Y'all can quite whiteknighting now. People on the internet sling around words like faggot and retarded because it gets reactions out of whiny people like you. That's why I used it. Get over it.
(sage for infighting)
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Whatever this species of turtle is.
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Alright sure just freehandle that venomous snake why don't you
Nah, RES are super popular in CA. If they are sold
under 4 inches in diameter then thats where it starts becoming illegal.
But I believe they are illegal in FL, which is why Solid Gold couldn't keep the baby RES that were gifted to her by that pond guy.
Anyone else kind of put off by Joey (The King of DIY) recently? He's always had small problems but he's mostly been good and informative with his care.. up until recently.
- He keeps impulse buying animals
Most of the animals he finds space for, but a lot even with his fish room, seems like he's squeezing in. Fish like Beans were given away after a few months and the manic reordering of his fishroom is testament to these impulse buys. All those arowana for example.
- He buys too many fish
He buys more fish than he knows his tanks can handle because he wants to pick the 'best' fish… the not-so-good-looking ones get sent back to the pet shop. Not exactly the most ethical way to run a fish room. This also means his tanks can be overcrowded in the meantime.
- He's killed a fair amount of his rainbows
Remember the rainbow fish tank which is now not a rainbow fish tank at all? He started with 200, there barely looks to be 50 left. We saw one of his stingrays eating one, no doubt it got more and with the manic reordering he kept doing on that tank I'm not surprised he stressed and killed fish.
- He didn't take criticism of the wood that killed Buddy
Old annoyance, but it took him a long ass time to get the wood out of the tank after it'd led to Buddy's death and in the meantime he kept his other smaller arowana in there. He only removed the wood when he decided to re-scape the tank completely because he impulse bought more arowana.
- He introduced ick into a tank by poor quarantine procedures and continues to quarantine badly
He only admitted this after he was able to cure his fish and blamed it on a net getting dipped in the tank. However quarantining one tank above another is just bad practice (even in the same room isn't advised). He has tanks in his house but of course they're full due to the amount of fish he's buying. So rather than waiting, he uses tanks in his gallery.
- He likes Brian Barczyk and just admitted on instagram that he wanted to get originally (and might still get) a Caiman for his fish room. Link: https://www.instagram.com/p/Bgru_OnnW8d/?taken-by=uarujoey
I would not be surprised at this stage if he impulse bought a caiman and then had to quickly make an enclosure for it.
There's probably more stuff I'm missing… I know he impulse bought some pleco's on his last trip to the store for salt. But it just feels like a lot of pet youtubers, including old school youtubers are amassing animals at unsustainable rates. In Joey's case he excuses it with the fact he can take them back to the shop… but imho that doesn't make it any better.
I don't blame him for the accident with the wood in the first place. But I do hold him accountable for keeping it in there and then introducing another arowana into the tank. I know he got backlash for keeping his large fish in completely bare tanks but there has to be some sort of middle ground. More so though as the wood was found to be a problem; keeping it in there and adding a different arowana seems to just be him being in denial.
>also, he wants the best looking fish for his tanks because it’s a gallery, so I don’t hold it against him that he sends the ones he doesn’t think fit back to the shop.
Sure. But there's better ways of doing it that don't treat the fish more like commodities than animals. SG aquatics has her own issues but I do like that she's stocking her fish room slowly and picking fish that she'll keep, not decide to get rid of later and buying en masse. For a guy who said he wanted to pick fish that are attainable for everyone; it's not a good example to be like I'll send the ones that don't colour up so well back to the shop and order 50% more than I need of each species.
>I still love him, though, his DIYs and care videos are actually very helpful.
I loved his old DIY stuff, but it doesn't seem he's doing much of that any more which is why I'm iffy on him. I really hope this is just a blip and he gets back to better fish care and just… caring about the fish he has in general. I mean just before the gallery he got all those goldfish and then almost immediately gave them back again. It's kind of unnerving how a fish guy who's not a shop owner has so little attachment to their fish.
I think she's trying to stretch out the videos instead of doing one video so she gets more views across all of them maybe?
I don't really get the ball python thing. I think morphs are cool, and saying everyone should just get a normal is kind of ridiculous imo. But honestly, I think she's right and a lot of it has turned into "oh boy look how much MY snake cost!"
It's the same with every other "collector". Sad but true.
Oh yeah. Some look pretty rad. But the community around them produces so many in so little time that the animals can't be properly cared for. So many snakes wasting away in small boxes bc they don't have the right color. Breeding, that kind of breeding, produces a lot of "breedjects".>>537135
You mean BHB Reptiles? I've seen a picture of him and Brian Barczyk arm wrestling for fun so I guess he's a supporter?
She states in the video that Danny has a large private collection. But from watching some of Danny's channel he states it too.
He's breeding those rhino rat snakes in the vid. She also says he's bred them before and that he trades them with a network of other snake breeders.
But yeah.. he's also chummy with Brian Barczyk. Although I would just consider him a shit breeder, not a BYB.
Either that or just the sheer number.
Maddie Smith once sort of called her out on twitter when she was "rehabilitating" a mouse and asked if she was licensed. Em liked the tweet but didn't reply. Sort of shady.
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On the subject of Em. I also notice how she doesn't show the enclosures of her snakes barring the breeding pair.
In her younow streams she often sits in front of a large rack of cages (although most don't appear to be snakes) just to give you an idea of how many animals Danny hordes.
For all TND gets shat on for her enclosures; I also think Em's are worse. Her ferret cage is barely passable (I've got the same one and I use it for rats). Her doves enclosure is laughably small and then with it right next to the ferret cage, letting them out into the room / landing on the ferret cage, a disaster waiting to happen. We all know about the disaster that was her betta fish tank (although that wasn't about size but flow, cycling and tank mates).
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Clearer picture of some more cages to her right. The wall is lined with them side to side.
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Is Grinchy in there now too? If so it must suck for the snakes with bird dust.
I was thinking about getting that cage for rats. I have some dwarfs though so I don't think bar spacing will pass there.
How is it compared to a DCN? It's hard to tell from her videos.
Exactly this. Even the new breeders I am finding just starting off are culling their normals for cobra food ect. All of the rescues in my area have high quality ball pythons, stuff like bananas and kingpins.
Part of me wonders if Taylor intends on breeding her ball pythons. Most rescues have rules against breeding animals that come from them (and it's also a bad idea anyways because you don't know the lineage), and also rules against rehoming animals that come from them. Taylor has a tendency to rehome animals, so maybe a rescue wouldn't even adopt out to her.
Easier imho to clean than a CN as you don't have to use fleece. You will use more substrate up though… like a lot more, so get a cheap source (recycled card horse bedding for example; you can buy bales of that for fairly cheap). I've also had very small rats in it; I would say dwarf size but as they were rescues I don't know for sure. I didn't have a problem, but you will want a different cage if you're getting them when they're not fully grown.
sage for ot
He said he’s treating it for mites.
I agree everything looks on the small side, but for his age his care is impressive. There’s some things to be concerned about but I don’t think it’s as bad as some people, that’s for sure.
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Happy tails took her bird and snake out at the same time during a livestream…
No. Those are her actual pets. She doesn’t feed birds.
She’s just irresponsible.
Almost as crazy as having her snake and birds out at the same time, is the fact that she still has this up on her Instagram like it is something to be proud of.
If you’re going to be a moron, at least have the decency to keep it to yourself and not share your idiocy with a bunch of children.
There’s so much wrong with her. She’s a hoarder, her enclosures are disgusting, her cages are all small, her pet room is crammed full, she owns like 40 animals that need daily attention and bonding ???? She thinks she’s a mother fucking queen, she states her shitty opinions as if they’re facts, she talks down on others, she backyard breeds, she has AWFUL diets for her animals.
God I know we give other petubers shit about things they do but nobody compares to the almighty happytails
Yeah he doesn’t at all. I own saltwater aquariums so I know a bit about them. I don’t know what he’s talking about it being “hard” to tell the gender. ALL clownfish are born males and then the most dominant clown of the group/pair will become female. (Clown fish have this ability) if the dominant female dies off, the next dominant male will become female and so on. This is why when most people buy a pair of clowns, they buy one slightly larger than the other so it’s easy for them to establish their dominance and create a male/female pair.
His tank also looks way too new to be adding a fish. A cycled tank should have some algae and detritus growth
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Anyone know anything about rabbits? Is her rabbit cage too small
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Maybe not that one, but this one is
You say temporary but she's had that rabbit a while >>540545
In her recent video you can see the rabbit shaking the pen and biting the bars in the background . Not a happy bunny.
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She posted this a few days ago. When it comes to bonding it’s better to take it slow, if you rush it they coukd injure each other.
And it could be stressed, but I know my rabbit does that when I’m in it’s room and it wants to come out to play. It could’ve just wanted to be let out since she was in the room
It’s possible it was stressed, but more likely it just wanted out because she’s in the room. Mine do that as well and their cage is a 3x9ft expen.
I’m all for calling someone out when it’s needed but I don’t know that it is here. Maybe just keep skeptical eyes on her if you’re concerned.
lol is it emma defending herself? lmao
i saw she mentioned lolcow in her tweet
So Emzotic's power went out at the start of the month. I don't think anyone's talked about this.
- She's burning scented candles when the lights go out, I thought that was a big no for birds.
- Also their backup generator failed but they didn't move their animals that need heat to another location. They seemed to have this as an option, so why they didn't do it, I really have no idea.
- She's still letting her doves attempt to breed in this vid too… because she wants two more doves and to feed the eggs to an unseen monitor lizard.
- Whose kids do they have… does Danny have children? How did they get there if the roads were all closed. How did he get out to go look for Diesel? If they'd just run out of fuel for the generator that isn't 'broken' that's just poor planning.
- Puts doves next to Grinchy despite said bird being visibly annoyed. Says it's ok because the doves are too dumb to be afraid.
TLDR: List of dead animals: 2 cardinal tetra, bumblebee goby, several pea puffers. Not sure if this wasn't just because of her documented shit fish care tbh.
I agree that they are most likely breeding and selling on the side. Em recently admitted that Danny is breeding certain snakes that he trades within a “small circle” of friends. In theory that’s fine, but in reality breeding animals doesn’t usually work out so smoothly (ie; the exact amount of hatchlings for the exact amount of “friends” who have the exact necessary setup and are willing to trade you exactly what you want in return…)
Putting that info together with the casual way she’s mentioned breeding in the past (her doves, her failed attempt at setting up the beta tank) I would be more surprised if they weren’t quietly breeding and selling certain animals.
"cages" on the floor with no cover, and bonding time in a bath where all they can see is white around them. The rabbits should be well off the floor in a cage that is enclosed at top and one side. Makeshift cages on the floor, what is this
>bath just has a blanket with food strewn on it
And you wonder why most people's pet buns die at 4-6 when lifespan can be 9-10. Half-assed care like this
Notice how on here >>540526
the bunny is sitting on what this dipshit owner probably thinks is a food? Or toilet? Area?
The whole ground should be covered with hay, this really limits the usable area for the bun. There's no waste/poops visible on the blankets on the floor which suggests she just put them down for the photo and maybe the used cage is somewhere else, or buns only sit/use the food area. It's impossible to properly clean a blanket on the ground
which really points to this not being the actual permanent cage for them.
/half-assed bunny care
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Let me guess she's another weeaboo instagram thot that believes she's 1% Japanese. And wtf does she know about diets? She can't even feed her own pet right, why is she even talking?
>>541416>The rabbits should be well off the floor in a cage
i'm sorry what??? Any cage that can be well of the floor(as in on a table I assume you mean) is too small. Also if the caged is well off the floor someone would need to pick up the bunny to move it to and from the enclosure. The bunny wouldn't be free to return to go to and from their litter box during free roam time.
Her pens are definitely a bit too small but otherwise fine .
To be fair she's not really wrong in this.
Personally I would never feed my omnivorous / carnivorous animals a plant based diet, but it can be done and is sometimes done for a variety of necessary reasons. Synthetic taurine is in fact added to a lot of kibbles as the main source and a majority of folks feed their animals like that.
Are there better diets… hell yes… is this the worst/animal abuse. Eh… I don't think so.
I agree with her in so far as she probably was targeted because a certain subset of folks see the word vegan and go ape shit. And no, I'm not a vegan myself. There are actual problematic
vegan's out there… Freelee and a good portion of the raw food promoting ones come to mind. This seems so meh in comparison.
General knowledge about rabbit care is woefully inadequate. Just because they are silent animals they get neglected. The environment should be as natural as possible, meaning fleece is not a good thing to be on the ground. Also the fresh veg scattered in the "bonding" area - fresh veg in such quantity can cause digestive trouble leading to death. Most amateur bunny owners feed a lot of fresh veg and the buns live for 5 years tops, sometimes only months. It should be mostly dry food.
Weirdly the care for the lone bunny in the smaller cage is better, a water bowl instead of a feeder, dry food. But the floor should be a solid plastic/wipe clean surface, covered with newspaper/scrap paper with a thick layer of hay over that. I think I read somewhere wood shavings are dangerous/sharp for buns (the hay/toilet area). Basically all these things need adjusting.
Rabbits also need somewhere to climb, and being on the ground as a prey animal, in bright light with everything going on around them is going to cause stress. They should be raised off the ground with 1/2 sides covered for privacy.
This is a temporary cage setup but presuming the animals never "bond", she should look at more suitable setups where the rabbits feel safer and more cosy.
You can get multi-tiered cages so they have more area to run around in.
Taking the bun in and out of the cage is fine. You take the food and water bowls out and put them on the ground, and train them to use a litter tray when they're out of the cage.
Older buns are not great at using litter trays so then you pop them back in the cage every hour or so to give them a chance to go there.
The benefits are you don't have an anxious bunny with everyone stomping around it, no privacy and other pets having easy access to it
She's from Spain (where they are now illegal to sell but weren't when she first got him?). She says in the vid she got the fox from a guy who bred them but wanted to keep Jumanji and only sold him when his male was aggressive.
Her complaint in the video seems to be, not that Jumanji was from a breeder, but that the original chick pointing it out and calling her out on it, is also a breeder, so it's hypocritical. Not really the same though imo as the chick breeds rabbits, but I mean I guess… as she later goes on to say she wouldn't buy bred animals again or in the future and is now against it.
>>541522>I suggest doing more in-depth research.
>I had a house rabbit who lived happily for 11.5 years despite life expectancy for his breed being 7-9 years
Are you dumb? What I wrote is correct. As evidenced by the exceeded life expectancy of the bun I had in that environment.
But knock yourself out feeding rabbits plenty of fresh veg and giving it fleece to sleep on. It will die by aged 5 but whatever makes you happy
You saying that your evidence came from the rabbit that you had that exceeded life expectancy is comparable with people using the oldest dog in the world who was fed vegan as an excuse to feed their dogs vegan lol
Seriously, where else is your care information coming from other than yourself? The house rabbit society is a great place to look and they are a credible source.
Another thing; dry pellets shouldn't make up the bulk of their diet either. If you're all about keeping them 'natural' wouldn't you be leaning more towards a hay based diet rather than pellets?
I suggest you do a little more research.
>>541544>You still don’t list multiple sources of where you’ve learned any of your informantion
Because web urls are valid sources, trumping real life experience. If my bun got 1.5 years older than yours I think that counts as some sort of proof.
I did most of my research 11 years ago (actually 12 since he died over a year ago) and most of that was from official websites of the time, several books I bought, and many people's real-life experiences on a LJ bunny community.
Most I learned from actual life experience; bunny was happier in a multi-tiered cage, he chews anything and can hurt himself so fleece is not great as it can be ingested. Most people over-feed the fresh veg hence early death.
Just because everyone does something doesn't make it ok. Excess veg, ground cage, fleece ground all looks/is amateur and half-assed. People who do that stuff usually
get a dead bun. Someone I follow (training to be a vet!) let her rabbit eat fries
and surprisingly, it died. Another had a crate on the ground with lettuce thrown in and it lived a few months. Very few people seem to give a shit and half-assed setups like that Youtuber's don't help. People should
aim for natural environments that bear the sensitive/prey animal nature in mind and most people don't.
YES, web URLs are valid sources over your single rabbit living a long time? I don't know what you're even talking about here?
I'm not even the one talking about my bun, but wtf even is this.
If you read my post my sources are: Internet, and life experience. I'm well past the point of hyperlinking articles on rabbit care.
I think I could have got him living longer but we have shitty water in our area (which actually made me sick) so he could probably have got to 12 if we weren't all drinking it. :')
Back when I got my pet it was actually encouraged to keep rabbits outdoors rather than indoors. We made a large pen for him in the garden and he actually escaped and ran back into the house. Also a neighbors rabbit escaped from it's
house and also ran into our house on another occasion. So we can assume it was a welcoming/happy environment for the animal.
Internet advice changes, like I said 11 years ago they were promoting hutch rabbits. I don't believe using artificial surfaces like blankets/fleece is appropriate for a grazing animal. If that's what is recommended that's what's recommended but it seems illogical to me.
Everyone is free to raise their buns however they want, but natural is better than unnatural. I also have a dog who's 10 with zero health problems and still looks like a puppy, so I guess they are both just flukes.
this has to be a troll holy shit
if not, please stop feeding your (presumably fat) rabbits so many pellets and keeping them in a tiered ferret cage.
Don't even own rabbits and this:
>I did most of my research 11 years ago (actually 12 since he died over a year ago)
is likely why you're wrong. Things change, 11 years ago folks thought it was ok to keep goldfish in little bowls.
Don't you know that they have ramps and platforms in the wild?! Lmao
But yes, the overall care of animals has changed drastically in just the past couple years alone. 12 years ago, almost everyone automatically trusted what pet store employees said because they were "qualified". In the past few years, we've had people breaking away from that ideology and that's why animal care guides are improving and pet stores are starting to be questioned more and more.
TLDR; your care is wrong and your information is outdated.
I dunno if you are all just stans of that dumbass youtuber, but a pen in the corner of the room with copious fresh veg and a blanket is not good care for a rabbit. Tell yourself what you want. Those rabbits are not relaxed or happy, even from the photos.
>B-but it says so online
Ok keep believing everything you read online, ignoring the actual happiness of your pets and common sense of what rabbits like (being safe and warm in covered spaces).
I dunno if you are all just 12 years old but please try and use common sense. A rabbit is not a dog; you can't treat them the same and expect the same results
Shit man, I thought they lived in trees. Swinging from one branch to the other….
But seriously; I keep rats and it's even debated with them as to how much climbing space / area off the ground they need as the brown rat is a notoriously bad climber and as such; while they should have the option to climb; they should also have a large enough cage bottom so that they don't /have/ to. Making a bunny go up levels to have enough space therefore seems like such a poor idea to me. A large ground level cage is likely going to make them feel far less vulnerable. >>541666
Keep getting mad. But while you're at it read this easily googlable shit: http://best4bunny.com/bunny-care/housing-ideas/
Does this seem like they are in the AIR to you ?
They are literally in burrows underground, not ABOVE the ground. Lmao.
>>541678>open, unprotected spaces>puppy pens>more puppy pens
Again, zero of those rabbits are lying down, or even sitting in a relaxed pose. They are all on alert and awkward. One photo has bunnies lying beside a sofa who look relaxed. A clue they like to hide/feel secure which these open literal puppy pens
do not provide
A puppy pen is not underground either. A multi-tiered cage is closer
to a warren than an open-top puppy pen with no privacy or safety. Nobody is considering they are prey animals who need to feel safe and secure. Open puppy pens are completely the opposite of that.
No a multi tired cage is not closer to a warren.
And this: http://www.rabbitrehome.org.uk/care/images/hutch_palace2.jpg
And this: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/NXwAAOSwnHZYQcRh/s-l225.jpg
Is not closer to a warren.
Rabbits should have appropriate cover in their ground level cage (hides, boxes etc), and yes, things to hop on / over etc. but putting them up in the air isn't a substitute for adequate ground level space.
Do you know where rabbits live in the wild? Here http://www.scienceimage.csiro.au/images/cache/detail/739_0_DA2351.jpg
Open space allows them to see predators, yes they are sometimes alert in open spaces, that is natural normal behaviour. Sticking them in the air is not.
I agree that her bunnies should have some more cover, but everything else seems like a STRETCH.
1. Fleece is perfectly safe for bunnies. Rabbits have very sensitive feet, so they need something soft to walk and hop on, which makes fleece an appropriate option.
2. Bonding in a bathtub is one of the best ways to bond rabbits??? When bonding you need to put them in a space neither are familiar with, and it should be small. Bathtubs make ideal spaces
3. Rabbits NEED vegetables daily. Some of y’all don’t know anything. Only unsafe veggies cause digestive issues, but these all look to be safe options.
4. Whoever the hell is suggesting a multi tiered cage is fucked in the head. Rabbits are ground dwelling animals, they need floor space. Not height and levels.
5. The minimum for a rabbit is a 2x4 cage. Her cages are over the minimum
6. The floor doesn’t need to be covered in hay? As long as they have a hay box where hay is available 24/7 then they’re fine, and it appears hers have that
do y’all even know that here’s a HUGE difference between domestic rabbits and wild rabbits ? If we’re going by that logic, I guess we should all keep our dogs in packs and make them dens wnd let them hunt their own food
Sorry Im thinking I hit the wrong one to reply to.
But yeah people do realize were talking about rabbits and not chinchillas right?
Hello guys! Emma here
Quickly I’d like to say that I don’t think I’m perfect, I make mistakes, just like everyone else. But I’m ALWAYS open to critism and I’m more than happy to have discussions with people about my pet care. If you see an issue with my care, PLEASE let me know. If something is brought to my attention, I will always do more research on the subject to see if it’s something I need to fix or not.
My DMs are ALWAYS open, if you want to talk to me about my care, you can message me on twitter, Instagram, or Snapchat. You can tweet at me as well. I am ALWAYS willing to discuss my care, and improve it if need be.
I’m no animal expert, I’m no “queen” of petcare. I’m simply an 18 year old girl who likes animals. I’m goinb to make mistake, I’m not perfect. If you see something wrong with my care, PLEASE let me know so I can look further into it, and make adjustments if need be.
If any of you have been with my channel for a while, you’re probably already aware of some of the mistakes I’ve made. When I got my first hamster back in the summer, his cage was FAR too small. But thankfully, people pointed that out to me, so I fixed it!
If anyone would like to have a serious discussion with me about my rabbit care or anything else, you can contact me at any of these here, listen below. I respond to every message I get
BUT, since you guys seem to be concerned, and don’t want to talk to me about it, I will clear things up for you.
My pair of rabbits are currently in a 4x4 pen, and my single rabbit is in a 4x3 pen. I agree with you guys, these cages are not as big as I’d like them to be, but while they’re still being bonded, they need to be separated, and due to the fact that my house is not my own, my rabbits MUST be kept in my small animal room, at the house owners wishes.
This also applies to my hamsters and why they needed to be downgraded, it was at the home owners wishes, that all my small animals be kept in my small animal room, and the fact I needed room for my fish tank.
Now people often ask me why it’s taking so long to bond my rabbits, the truth is, it really isn’t taking too long. When I first adopted sunny, I quarantined her for 6 weeks. So I did not do any bonding at the point. I’ve only been working on bonding them the past few weeks.
Once my rabbits are fully bonded, there will be A LOT of changes made to my pet room. I’ll be making a custom unit, for my bunnies, hamsters and mice. Once bonded, my rabbits will be getting a 9x6 pen, with a roof and walls for added security. Since they will have a solid roof, I will have all that room to build my hamste and mouse cages on top. It has already been designed. My hamsters will each have a 4x3 cage, and my mice will have a 3x2 cage :) these changes will all be made hopefully within the next month, once my rabbits are bonded.
My rabbits pens are temporary, as well as my hamsters bin cages. But even then, I still make sure they meet the minimum size recommendations. (2x4 for bunnies and 450 square inches for hamsters)
If you have any more questions or concerned about my care please feel free to point it out and or ask me about it and I will be happy to discuss with you
When my hamster chewed through the detolf, I talked to more experienced hamster owners and asked them about it. Many people told me that she was stressed out due to how big the detolf was. I rescued her from a family who previously kept her in a critter-trail, she had lived her whole life in tiny spaces and that’s what she was used to.
I agree that bigger cages are better, but since she was in a small cage previously, I think I need to adjust her slowly, rather than going straight from a critter trail to a detolf.
She has been much better in the bin cage, she seems to be much mess stressed than she was before. And now that she’s had more time to get used to the bin cage, I feel it will be easier to put her in a larger cage next. I just need to take it slow.
As stated above, both my hamsters will be getting 4x3 cages in the near future. The bins are temporary :)
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You quranteed her for 6 or 8 weeks? Which is it?
I did, and she was still stressed. As I said, she’s getting a bigger cage very soon. Please remember you guys only see what I share on the internet. I was VERY concerned about my hamster and how stressed out she was. I tried multiple different things to see how she reacted. I tried giving her more hides, more toys, I tried giving her more time out of the cage, I tried using different beddings, I tried giving her more bedding to burrow in, more things to dig in, etc. I tried ALL of this and none of it made a difference. Then I moved her to a bin cage and she’s doing MUCH better. She’s not tried to chew out, she’s no longer cage surfing, she has much better behaviour now.
I work very closely with my vet. My animals well being is very important to me, and I’ve found the cage switch was what worked best for her. I really, truly think that by slowly upgrading her, rather than making a HUGE jump is going to benefit her much better in the long run
It was 6 weeks. From the time I got her (first week in January, to when I first moved. (Middle of February)
I didn’t have a strict 6/8 week period, it was just the time before I moved which I knew was around 1-1/2-2 months
Holy fuck this thread.>>541409
She's basing her fox's taurine needs off of a domestic cat's taurine needs, which will eventually kill it. She's currently giving her fox 100 mg of taurine, which is more than adequate for a house cat. But fennec foxes need 500 mg of taurine. The deficiency can lead to a slow deterioration and cause issues like permanent vision loss or total blindness and heart issues. I had more respect for her when I had thought the diet was due to an unknown allergy, but now she has come outright that allergies (plant pollen, not meat btw) have nothing to do with it, it's all about her feelings, which leads me to believe that if there was something with the diet, she would be very hesitant to change it. I also question as to why she would get not just scavenging carnivore but an obligate carnivore when you never intended on feeding the animal meat?
She also deflects like a mother-fucker and would rather paint someone else in a bad light than just address the issues at hand. Most of her video explaining shit was really just shitting on some lady. Of all the pet youtubers, she's honestly the most sensationalist one I've seen so far, and that is saying a lot considering the type of people that pick up youtube hobby. She blocks any criticism or anything that isn't automatically praising her, which I can see in the recent wake of things but it has been going on long before she became infamous. She spouts some dumb feminism logic about breeding animals when she most likely bought hers from a breeder. All that being said, no one deserves death threats, people have to cut this shit out.
people have moved way on from this, her fox is doing fine nutritionally. hes getting regular vet visits to be sure hes not malnourished and is being fed a diet recommended by a vet (i think she said shes been recommended a similar diet by multiple vets but i could be wrong). she used to feed him meat, shes not opposed to carnivores eating meat.
and your information is wild tbh, fennec foxes need around 250mg of taurine per kg. she has a male fennec fox, they weighy roughly 0.5/1 kg, so he should be getting around 125-250mg of taurine which is easily attainable. taurine isnt even the most important aspect of their diet tho? like i do agree that in general as a species they should be fed insects, but hes not gonna die. the amount of drama thats surrounding her care i wouldnt doubt people have called animal services to check that jumanji is in good health.
also whats "feminist logic" got to do with breeding animals? sit down man theres far worse neglect going on in the pet youtuber community.
if youre really conserned for feline health look at tnd's care, thats something to get really mad about
Some animals like the snapping turtle are kept in the basement… makes me wonder what happened to the animals down there when they had that blackout. We heard nothing of it or the snakes that Danny was breeding.
There were very few animals in that box with the heatpads. I mean you only need to look at the shelves behind them full of cages to know they have far more animals than could fit in that box.
I wonder the same with Maddie since she has three tegus on top of her 30+ other animals she has stuffed in her parents house.
I know theres a bunch of Maddie stans in this thread, but she definitely has a lot of issues. Her knowledge and 'experience' may be a bit better than TND and HappyTails, but her hoarding is just as bad. She posted a "meet my 50 pets" video, but then three months later posted a "feeding my 30+ pets." Wtf happened to those TWENTY animals in three months?
She used to breed rats and she had a lot of rats from litters that she was getting veterinary treatment before she let them go home. She said that in her meet my pets video.
Also her tegu enclosure is over what is average ( 6 x 3 x 3 ), so I'm sure they're not just stuffed somewhere like Taylor's monitor.
I really wouldn’t call Maddie a hoarder. She rehabs animals and used to breed rats so her animals she had would change quite often.
As far as her actual pets go like her tegus, snakes, dogs etc they all seem to be very well cared for
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God, I'm so sick of Pet Youtubers using clickbait titles. Tyler did the same thing with "lol oh no my snake bit me and it's super bad!!!! April Fools!!!!!!" last year
This video is one of those obligatory "don't get bunnies for Easter" things, but clickbait in the pet youtube community is infinitely more annoying than like how it's used in the storytime community.
Because they go along with the "joke" for several minutes, which is essentially just advertising bad animal care, which wouldn't be that much of an issue if people's attention span's weren't so short that it gauruntees most people don't watch the videos until the end to get the "joke"
I prefer to not judge people on their voices or appearance, but the quality of their content and the care of their animals.
Maybe that's just me.
I'm just here because I want peoples animals to be properly cared for and the correct information to be portrayed to their viewers.
This is an anonymous forum on a website where people post about internet lolcows and why they're awful.
If you're looking for some bastion of moral superiority where people don't just say what they feel, this ain't it lmao.
Lol no need to get triggered
, anything is up for discussion here
It's hard to focus on the 'quality' of her content when you find it difficult to listen to though.
She also made a slime video using borax and was handling her leopard gecko whilst doing it, even though she said she wasn't getting the slime anywhere near the reptile you could see some of it on her hands.
10/10 animal care there
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You can see the shaving foam on her hand before she picks the gecko up in this screenshot
I'm not triggered
, lol. I'm always open for debate, but there's not much that can be debated about someone's voice ig lol
I’m so confused at some of y’all. You go on to say this thread is about animal care and calling out bad care, but then also go in to be like “I can’t stand her voice! So annoying!!!!¡¡¡¡” Since WHEN does someone’s voice reflect on the their animals care LMAO
Y’all are whack. If you want to actually draw attention to issues, use legitimate points.
Saying “I can’t watch more than a minute of her video because her voice is annoying so I fell for her clickbait!!! Oh no!!!”
Just makes you look like a little whiny bitch
I’d have to agree with the other person. What the hell is even the point of discussing someone’s voice lmao. Not like they can help it, and not like it accomplishes anything.
If we want petubers to make changes in their videos/care/etc I don’t think whining about someone’s voice is the way to do it….
I get that anything can be up for discussion here, but I’m sure most of us have the same goal, we want petubers to do better and I don’t think whining about people’s vouces is the way to do that
it was just one comment calm down…
if they genuinely come to this thread and cherry pick that one comment then they obviously aren't coming to this thread to listen to people's advice or criticism
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Her twitter post was..
SOOO glad someone else is mad about this! I just watched her vid and was shocked at what she was promoting. It's becoming less controversial among beardie keepers to state as fact that calcium sand is just wrong to use, but because she clearly had to recite something of a script in return for the free tank (notice how many times she claimed this was a "premium bearded dragon setup") she chose to promote misinformation rather than ditch it like she should have.
So much wrong. The calcium sand, the constant feeding of mealworms, feeding them ON the sand, the coil UVB, and correct me if I'm wrong but this tank is a 3ft? The minimum for an adult beardie is a 4 x 2 x 2, and she even states this herself on twitter. But when I googled the tank AND followed the links to it she posted on amazon, it says it's 91 x 42 x 42cm.
This might be a cultural difference, which may also explain why Em is saying one thing but doing another (assuming she's in the US again?) In my country it is standard to keep them in 4 x 2 x 2 minimum, I've never seen a smaller tank aimed at bearded dragons in stores. There's one popular kit (including the bad lighting unfortunately) that is similar to Em's one, but it is a 4ft rather than 3. But I know in USA smaller setups are often common for a lot of reptiles.
It is funny she's no issue calling it a premium setup when it is, where I live, below bare minimum, and according to herself it is, too. In the USA where sizes are a bit less extravagant it's still only bare minimum. Very disappointing of her to tout this like it's the best.
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happy tails got a blue eyed leucistic ball python because she wanted "something special" for her birthday. she of course opened this semi-arboreal snake which is known to eat bird in the wild in a room with free roaming birds, because of course she would.
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I find it really interesting and funny how this person gave Em constructive criticism and Em completely ignored their info and just was like "oh don't worry I want people to share their tips"
Same anon as above
I know any sand is generally seen as dangerous bc any beardie can end up accidently swallowing it, no matter "your experience with sand", either way Em ignored the person's info completely, which is ironic considering that she said she wants nice criticism.
I'm gonna go ahead and say the first part was a dig at Taylor. I know we don't like that here but considering the recent drama… eh.
If she's being given money to promote the product she can't say that it is very likely to do this and that and possibly kill your animal. Wonder if money is running low or she is stooping to low levels.
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"Animals are not accessories"
You sure hun?
This is probably why we don’t know how many animals they actually have and therefore the conditions the animals live in.
I honestly hope she didn’t get more popular and then it comes out that she has hoarding habits or is simply not meeting the animal needs
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Is this because folks called her out on her weird foot fetish shit? Or because she was using her snakes as props? Or because her beardie set up was so abysmally bad?
Or did something else happen?
Shes also in london at the moment so it could be about not wanting to go back to the states or something and not youtube related
sage for speculation
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I'm actually guessing this is because of the beardie drama. Her video was trash and a lot of people recognised the fact she was just doing it for $$$. It's a shame she sold out, she was a lot better before she moved to the US. I know she's been with Danny for a while but I can't help but think his hoarding/breeding and general lack of knowledge on certain animals while thinking he knows it all (fish for instance and apparently bearded dragons if this is 'ok'), has rubbed off.
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I can't believe Em liked that comment. Wtf?
That's the people paying her to promote their products, no?
Point here is - if she's being paid to promote the products there is a script she must follow, she can't suddenly go on a tangent and be like ''actually this is really shit'' but can go around it by saying ''people have different experiences and you should do your own research'' - the actual issue here is the fact that she is knowingly promoting a product that is wrong.
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Shouldn't adverts be tagged, or at least obviously listed as such. Kind of shady she's promoing all these shoes but not saying they're adverts.
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She deleted this tweet, I think. But jfc Em. No. You're preaching sisterhood and all that crap but lowkey shaming women who get an abortion? I don't know what she's going through and obvs. I'm sorry if she has lost another child. My condolences. But was that tweet REALLY necessary?
On her instagram she posts pictures of pet foods and treats she makes and links the youtube video of the recipe, which have all been vegan foods based on cat's diet, and anything she talks or writes (youtube and instagram, respectively) about when it comes to diets are pre-made dog and cat raw vegan diets, she's only a part of vegan cat food groups on facebook, and she never actually goes into detail about the science behind her animal's nutrition, i believe because she doesn't actually understand it hence the pre-made foods. I would not be surprised at all if a vet didn't give good information on pet foods, as vets usually aren't taught a lot on nutrition and what they are taught is usually shilled by a company. I took a nutrition class with vets and vet techs which was basically a 2 week seminar provided by Hills.>>543313
I didn't realized you police what is discussed, my apologies. I have only ever read that fennec foxes should have 500mg taurine pill 1xd. Even so, let's pretend the recommended or even an amount to survive on is half of that - a cat based diet has around 75-100mg of taurine daily. Still less than half of what the fox needs to your standards. It doesn't matter if taurine isn't the most important, why is this even an argument? That's like saying 'this person is feeding their dog KFC diet but hey it can be worse'. I'd say a lack of taurine is seriously bad though considering the poor this is already half blind. Of course it could be worse, she could just not feed it at all. But I'm not going to kiss someone's feet because they feed a pet a shitty diet vs not feeding it at all. Never have I stated the thing was underweight, idk why you felt the need to address that as if I were attacking you. Last I checked she lived in Spain, which virtually has no laws regarding animal welfare. You're expecting a country that legally allows bullfighting and turns a blind eye to dogs being hung en masse yearly to get up in arms over one pet fox?
As for the feminist bit; I was noting the logic was not logical, don't worry i wasn't attacking feminist as a whole just her views. These threads are to talk about people's poor choices and bad reasoning. I'm not quite sure what you expected here… do you know what site you're on? People are more likely to voice criticism and concern rather than compliments
This isn't the TND thread that's why I'm not talking about TND here, she has her own thread. Why can't I talk about this spanish bitch here? It's on topic and not breaking rules.
Yea which vid are you talkin about?
Idk what enzotic is doing esp w the beardie setup issues in that vid but I’m watching less of the ‘bigger’ channels and preferring the smaller ones. They seem to just be getting to many pets for views. I still watch Tyler rugge mostly bc he takes care of his pets and stuff but I still prefer channels like Gabe varns, Loris hartland, and Emma samson I love rabbits so lol I just found lori a few weeks ago but she doesnt buy a lot of animals and she does a lot of research her vids are really good. Emzotic did ask on twitter today about peoples thoughts on the pet community so maybe she is seeing what people are saying.
It was a poll, check before you post.
She asked if petube lost innocence with the replies being yes and no. A lot of people are saying no. She liked a few replies tho.
One thing I haven’t seen brought up after I watched a couple videos about Grinchy is I think the pet store she got him from brought him in because of her videos. She talked about how when she bought him she lectured the people at the shop to think about their customer base before bringing in exotic wild caught animals and who are they expecting to buy them. But it seems like she shops there frequently and they probably have seen her videos, so they brought him in expecting her to buy him, and lo and behold, she did!
Pure speculation, but the situation seems dodgy to me.
I haven’t thought that way about it and I don’t know if it’s likely, it’s hard to know but I definitely think that taking Grinchy was a huge move and one of the main things that made me hesitant about Em.
He was in a sorry state when she took him home, and physically it looks as if his health has improved, but…what next? He’s living in a cage and she’s taming him. What will she do with him long term? He’s a wild bird. He will never make a good pet, and I don’t know what type of bird he is but I understand most birds live a long time? She doesn’t strike me as entirely wanting to live in the USA forever. She’s not even there now afaik? Birds are so intelligent and I doubt Grinchy is tame enough that the presence of strangers wouldn’t stress him out.
I usually disagree with “rescuing” animals by buying them and then dumping them on a rescue centre, but I really think some sort of avian centre would be the best place to take care of Grinchy and possibly give him access to outdoor aviaries where he can be a bird again, instead of a bird in a cage in a dark room.
I think she decided to keep him because she used to work with the same bird species, but yes other than that it's all a bit eh.
She also talked to the shop manager and said she wouldn't buy from there again if they imported more wild-caught birds, and only got the bird because he had been there for months. I sort of understand that as a point, essentially he would have been doomed to die there or in very bad care so at least having someone experienced looking after him is better, but even then some sanctuaries or even zoos may consider taking him in?
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Maybe Jenni can teach her how to properly cycle a tank XD
>>552109>badly filtered fish tanks
Am I missing something? I thought she cycled all her media with ammonia before adding it to a tank.
I will also add there's nothing really wrong with bare bottom tanks, especially when you've got something that produces a lot of waste like goldfish.
For leopard geckos, females can be housed together if there’s space for each of them. Males cant be housed together. As for her fishes, having bare bottom tanks/pools for goldfish is not bad especially when they make alot of waste. Honestly, if you were to own alot of fishes like she does without overcrowding them in one tank, you’ll want what she has, a whole lotta tanks and pools, and having that much requires alot of cleaning so you’ll want bare bottoms for easier cleaning. Her fishes are beautiful and it’s obvious she cares for them deeply
When you say predator/prey thing i assume you mean her cats? Honestly it all depends on your pets and if you trust them enough. If you gave my cat (own her for 18 years now) a hamster, however old she is, she wont know what to do with it and just end up meowing to me. I had a perekeet escape before and landed near her and all my cat did was alert me that my perekeet was there but if that happens around my aunt’s cat, she’ll try to attack it the moment they get close so It all depends on your pets personality which you can easily tell if you pay enough attention to their body language
theres nothing wrong with bare bottom, but she has no enrichment at all in those tubs. her ponds are perfect tho. the sponge filters in her tubs arent enough for the bioload of so many goldfish>>552554
predator/prey interaction still stresses the prey animals tho. her bunnys view the cats as a potential danger, maybe theyve gotten used to them by now but its risky to introduce them and the rabbits will almost always be terrified when first introduced to a predator animal
Goldfish don't really
need enrichment. They're social fish and certainly get a lot out of being housed together, but a goldfish in a bare tank is not going to start self harming, or performing stereotypical behaviour- worst case scenario, it'll look forward to feeding time more. Not to mention telescopes are very prone to injury on decor.
The sponge filters I had my doubts about too, but they provide plenty of surface area for beneficial bacteria. Mechanical filtration might be lacking, but that's fine with twice weekly water changes/ understocking, as Jennie does.
Also, dude, everything is a predator to a rabbit. Humans are a predator to a rabbit, and they get used to us. Her cats obviously aren't a threat, and the rabbits are obviously used to them.
Yeah I don't think her sponge filters are lacking either, so long as they're fully cycled (which they appear to be / she made a video on cycling all of her media so she knows they should be).
As far as water changes go, I suspect she changes fairly often, the goldfish tubs never appeared dirty in any of her videos at least.
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Anyone else see this? I’m super curious
I'm not, curious that is. Em likes to stir up so much drama all the time.
Guessing the content of this vid goes something like this:
Q_Q Pet youtubers are people too
Q_Q People make mistakes
Q_Q Pet youtubers make mistakes
Q_Q People should be kinder and not call out pet youtubers on their BS.
Q_Q More excuses for impulse buying and hoarding.
Really don't get why she included Emma in the thumbnail tbh? she doesn't have that many subscribers compared to other pet tubers that she's left out of it
not that numbers matter, but if shes going for clickbait, its a strange choice when someone elses face could've been there
It all depends on the direction this video is going to go, but im surprised to see Erinsanimals on there. Shes a really nice person who focuses on a few species of animals and really goes into depth with their care.
The rest of the people on here (besides the spider guy who called taylor out) are all 'collect as many different species as i can' youtubers - which was one of the main things i saw brought up in Emzotics twitter thread.
Also so much for Emzotic going off on twitter about how shes 'strayed away from the direction she wants her channel to go and wants to steer it more towards her original content'
what the fuck is this video then?
I wonder if she reads here and has realised that people are noticing the many flaws she makes. Not only here but also on YouTube, hence why she strayed from the content she wanted to upload - correct and informative.
She did like a few comments that said that people are impulse buying animals on the poll so there is hope, but if she defends these people (who have done wrong, not everyone obv) then honestly fuck you Em.
Why's she got such a morale high ground?
"I am the best pettuber everyone should look up to me"
what a troglodyte
She says shes not getting anymore animals in the future. We'll see.
Doesn't mean that 'danny' won't get more animals that she'll just keep a secret to look like a bigger and better person though
She goes on and on about how she’s not an “expert” but then admits she’s an “educator.” Is she really going to try to defend herself with semantics? Expert or educator or whatever, wrong information is wrong.
Glad she discouraged pet hoarding but then immediately said she’s got two more animals to introduce, is getting another bird, and wants a dog kek
so em's been dreading uploading videos because there is a small minority of people waiting to see her slip up. oh i wonder who's she talking about.
in all seriousness, i think we all are actually hoping you do better, but are critical enough to see the slipups. we are not trying to drag you through the mud if you make a mistake, but it's your responsibility as a bigger creator to stand for what you put out and not spread misinformation.
i think there are two definite types of pet yt creators - pet lifestyle and pet hobby. perhaps it's just a personal preference that i don't like the first one. these are people whose care is not rooted in science and genuine interest about animals and nature, but like having a tame exotic animal to do things with. i guess it comes down to personal beliefs and preferences whether it is ok or not. i could just ignore these channels and stay in my corner of pettube (chill aquarium and terrarium hobby channels like aquapros, serpadesign, etc). i could stay away and 'stop hating', em, but do you really want all the people be either apathetic or in love with you? you describe people criticizing you as a predators out to catch you… i think that's a disturbing outlook to have.
How odd to say she will only show a few animals after the fish video and bearded dragon video, something is seriously off about her care which is why she's avoiding it I think.
Also what is it with them wanting to breed birds? I wonder if they are gonna be put into 'trading' circle Danny apparently has.
I'm sorry to say but there is something seriously fishy going on I think.
Like many pet youtubers, she seems incapable of actually owning up to her mistakes and making them better.
This video was full of a lot of rambling nothing. Perhaps she'll address the 'cycled water' and 'keeping beta together' and 'breeding beta' in her next video… perhaps not… but there's a good portion of bad pet care and impulse buying she put out there and has not redacted or removed (I don't care what she says about Grinchy, he was impulse bought because she felt sorry for him. She didn't plan to have him. Just like the doves, and the crab.).
And that's putting everything else (snapping turtle mishandling, snake breeding, not showing most enclosures, providing bare minimum enclosures she does show), aside.
Having it out for a long time during her video, holding it up off the ground, stating it feels vulnerable when being held up…. still holding it up. I don't think the poor thing was on the ground for the entirety of her video. Then teasing it with a cucumber till it bit the cucumber in half for her viewers.
Not the worst thing ever, but still hypocritical considering she was doing the exact opposite of what she was telling folks to do (including and not limited to, the fact she said you shouldn't keep them as a pet in the first place).
As an aside, the turtle is quite large (although not maximum size), it's kept in the basement, we never see it's enclosure. Makes me think it's not kept in the best conditions.
Honestly I feel like I understood what she was trying to say in the vid but she didn’t have a follow through. Asking channels to leave their stuff in the comments (like they won’t get lost) she had a opportunity to show the channels she was talking about. Saying you don’t need a lot of animals to do well, and saying for creators no to buy them, but put people who have tons on the thumbnail. Obviously it’s just a thumb but she could have showcased or even mentioned some great channels that get overlooked.
Or even Maddie
Instead she showd happytails and that guy who made a vid on Taylr?
Not trying to be picky bt she had a opportunity to showcase rhe change she wants to see and she didn’t.
She has no follow through for anything. Not for fixing her care, apologising for misinformation etc etc.
She's also not going to highlight actual good pet youtubers because that would show how poor she really is… and it would take the spotlight away from her. She already hinted at that with the whole 'pet youtubers should diversify and not do all the same thing' which reads as 'stop copying me' despite what she might think.
She didn’t even mention most of the people in her thumbnail anyway. I agree mentioning some smaller creators instead of asking people to put their links below where they were going to get buried no matter what would’ve been better.
Gabe did a better video on this really. And people like Lori’s Hartland, Pugpibblehedgie, Imee’s World, etc had good conversation about it on Twitter for a while. I hope other pettubers do videos on their opinions on where pettube is right now. I bet we would hear things a lot different from the smaller channels.
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Anyone else see this? I think it’s cool to see a pet youtuber actually putting effort into giving their pet a quality diet. I feel like a lot of them just do whatever is quickest, cheapest and most convenient. A lot of pet youtubers have blue tongues and I feel like they all just feed dog food because that’s what everyone else does. Idk I just thought this was neat
Did you watch the video? They release them all into one massive reptile room.
Tbh I don't think they're going to swarm / bully anything due to the size of the room. But some reptile keeper needs to chime in on the species kept together in that room because that's what struck me as iffy.
She does have a lot, but regardless they seem to be well cared for. No clue what her job is but she seems to have quite a lot of money and somehow also lots of time to care for them.
I tho k in her older videos she was still getting used to YouTube so her personality was kinda fake, which is why so many people compared her to TND. In her more recent videos, now that she seems to be more comfortable in front of the camera it’s much clearer that she’s being herself. I don’t think she was ever purposely trying to be Taylor, I think she just didn’t know how to be herself at first.
The only thing that concerns me with her is her age. She’s only 18 and has like 30+ pets. At 18 you just don’t really know where your life is going. Will she go to school? Move? Get a full time job? Etc. Right now she seems to have lots of free time, but if she went to school I’m sure that would all change
Do you ever wonder if this thread has been 'loving' Emma because it is Emma.
What's with the influx of overly praising some people out of the blue, don't know how many times this Gabe persons been mentioned now but he doesn't have that many subscribers so I highly doubt a lot of his viewers are all over here suggesting his channel
Different anon here that just reads this thread mostly than posting but heres my thoughts on all these pet tubers.
At first, i started to watch “how to” videos of taking care of reptiles because i don’t own one and not planning to but i think they’re pretty awesome but i started to notice about these guys on youtube.
DiY King - i respect his videos. He’s a grown man that probably works on the side and provices for his family and his youtube is his hobby. It’s pretty obvious he’s passionate about aquatic animals and gets excited about them frequently BUT if he was really into them, he would be going into helping marine biologist and donating/helping marine conservationist (i think thats the word) like Paul Walker used to do if Joey is truly passionate about aqautic animals.
Solidgold - she’s another that shows passion when it comes to different goldfishes, but after awhile where is she going to go? Will she become a certified breeder of them? Become an educator of her favorite goldfish? Or will she continue to just buy more?
New pet tubers like Emma, gabe, etc - they’re obviously young and show love for their animals but starting on youtube about them. Will they eventually turn into a petube hoarder like the rest or will invest their money into going to some sort of animal field in college? They can either adapt with youtube and turn into a fun educational animal channel that focuses on fostering/etc, back out from youtube to go to college, or just turn into the next generation of hoarders.
TND, Happy Trails, Tyler, etc - they’re a lost cause. They will probably collect more animals for views or else they’ll be nobodies. They obviously don’t care aboutt their animals unless they look cool or match. They try to, but at the end of the day, they see their pets as easy money online until they cant keep up with the care anymore.
Serpadesign, snake discovery, afroherp, etc - the real educators that deserve more. Sadly though, there’s more viewers that gets bored easily than viewers who truly love their videos so either they adapt into being entertaining like a new generation of Steve Irwins or stay in the background and continue what they love with their few loyal subscribers.
Either way, most likely 80% of them will just turn into hoarders for money, which is sad. Poor animals.
Sage for blogging i think
IA with you, it kills me that she keeps slipping back under the radar because she deserves to be dragged to filth for her behaviour and treatment of those animals, like they’re just collectible objects to fill up her musty ass house. The best of her care is subpar at best, the rest is straight up neglect. She’s a hoarder worse than any of the others, she backyard bred her fucking dogs and for merle coloring no less.
I dislike TND as much as anybody but Happy Tails deserves just as much, maybe more callouts on yt/twitter etc because she is enabled with hardly any pushback on her awful care and hoarding. I honestly hate that woman lol
i just watched emzotics video its such a mess. shes claiming pet youtube is the first online community revolving around animal care, has she never heard of the online forums for animal care that have been around forever??
also trying to say people are laying in wait for youtubers "to get a fact wrong" is laughable, people follow those who have a record of messing up basic animal husbandry, neglecting their animals needs, of course people are going to follow their care so they can correct errors. yeah theres some people who just want to get mad at people, but most just want the best for their animals and the best care to be promoted, not just to be a "hater".
why is she getting so worked up about keeping her videos getting high views when she already has a main source of income other than youtube? that makes it sound like she just wants to be in the public eye, shes not promoting optimum animal husbandry and shes not getting money so why else is she on youtube? then saying "we need alot of animals to keep our income" lmao what??? what happened to "i have another main source of income"? no one is forcing them to do pettube, and they dont need to have hoards of animals to get views, just look at any animal channel.
AND THEN she says noone needs alot of animals to do pettube? sis…
she claims to forget basic care requirements because shes used to caring for more difficult species, which makes no sense. anyone who cares for difficult animals is going to have enough experience with animals that the basics are engrained in them and just become almost a reflex theres no reason they would regularly forget the basic care that theyve done over and over and over for animals.
finally she says that she doesnt have soace for any animals like a leopard gecko, but want to get grinchy a companion even though theyre extremely difficult to care for. she could give grinchy to a rescue who could care for him and give him a companion. and she wants a dog. girl. how does she not have space and time to care for a leopard gecko but she does for a DOG and an EXOTIC TIME CONSUMING BIRD. EM WHY
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Kek never noticed her twitter bio before
What a way to view yourself
Why does she have such a small fraction of followers compared to TND?
I can't be arsed to watch the video, but is it that can't source a leopard gecko, or that she can't find the time for one?
Also, not gonna lie, she's taking pretty great care of Grinchy, and Bettas aside, all her other animals too. I quite like her channel, it's her incessant need to be the bigger person and invent all these issues that aren't really existing in 95% of the community that's dragging her down lately.
Can't find time for one. And her other animal care isn't that great.
- Her ferret cage is more suitable to be a rat cage (I know, I used the same cage for my rats). It's not the worst, but they should have more space for sure.
- Her Doves cage is tiny. They absolutely should have more space. They also land on her ferret cage in several videos (assumed to do so regularly). She also wants to breed them.
- Her bearded dragon set up was awful for numerous reasons listed by anons here and on the youtube video she put out. Apparently this new set up was an upgrade and Bad Idea was kept in the dark before this.
- Her Betta fish tank was awful for a lot of reasons, not just putting an unconditioned female with a male but because the flow was far too strong (she didn't try and baffle it with anything or even get a spray bar or something), the tank was also not cycled.
- Grinchy is actually in a pretty small cage. Realistically most of her pets will spend most of their time inside their cages, as such large enclosures are a must. His cage should at least be double the size it is right now if not bigger. Especially as this is a wild caught bird that deserves better.
Her care used to be better in the UK… but then she used to have fewer animals. Danny /is/ a hoarder, he breeds them and he has a /lot/ of pets. So many that he nor Em will say exactly how many (huge red flag) or show their enclosures (probably because they're all below minimum size). You can see some of the 'collection' on the wall behind them in younow streams.
As far as her channel goes, again, much better before / near the start when the animals she showcased weren't all her own horde. However it's very clear from her reactions to fans in comments etc. that she can't take polite criticism and indeed is usually either snarky or rude in response to it. As others have said, she doesn't do anything to fix problems people point out. I don't think she's really being dragged down so much as exposed. I used to like her… now… hell no, she's as bad as the rest of them tbh.
Her ferret cage is pretty good considering they're inside (most ferrets are kept outsides) and seem to get a lot of stimulation from wondering around the room tbh.
I can't comment on how much they are actually outside of their cage of course, but they certainly seem like her 'favourite' pets she has.
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Her ferret cage is fine size wise if
they're getting their four hours minimum outside of it daily. They're not supposed to be in there for long periods of time.
Outdoors would be better for them tbh if she would build them a big run. A lot of people covert chicken coops for their ferrets but a custom is obviously preferable. As this is her ~job~ then she seriously needs to upgrade their homes to be the best they can be, not the minimum for survival.
Sorry but the 'as long as I get them out a lot, small cage is fine' is an excuse used by many a bad pet owner. It seems to me too as though it's the bare minimum. It doesn't have much enrichment as the other anon said. She should strive for much better, especially if those are her 'faves'.
I also know from experience that that cage is kind of top heavy and moves easily, good job those ferrets can't really bound about the top level.
Great cage for rats etc. poor cage for ferrets.
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Yeah, I do see that. However, I think if you're using a cage just as a bedroom or bed, then its fine.
For example, my sister has rabbits that are out of their hutch almost all of the time, except when she is asleep. But even then, their hutch is larger than the minimum recommended (its the size of a small bedroom).
However, that's a moot point cause we all know she's not letting them out the minimum, let alone enough. She needs a far better home for them, in every regard.
I agree. Not even saying she needs to build them a palace or anything… just something they wouldn't be so cramped in and could actually run around, if they're going to be in there most of the day.
This is the problem with pet youtubers in general though. The more animals they have the thinner their time is stretched. Even if they were perfect human beings with perfect care (which they're obviously not); there's only so many hours in the day.
Birds need interaction, ferrets need interaction even reptiles and snakes should have some interaction even if it's not as needed as mammals and birds. Sooner or later a pet youtuber runs out of time to give… and space for the enclosures…
Dobby and Nibbler aren't given enough space because there isn't any in the house with all the other cages and reptile rooms. They aren't given enough time because there aren't enough hours in the day.
The same goes for Grinchy and the Doves… and all the other pets that need interaction.
Then acquiring more animals, another Toucan… a /dog/. Yeah. No.
This is why all 'Pettubers' are awful.
I disagree, I don’t think ALL pet tubers are awful/hoarders etc. there are many pet tubers who I’ve watched and some I don’t watch but know of and they don’t have a lot of animals and take great care of them from what I can see. I will name a few (careful not to name too many wouldn’t want anyone to think I’m promoting something🙄) But here’s the truth as it is.
*Hammylux (only has a few hamsters and cats)
*Victoria Raechel has rabbits, hamster and a gecko.
*Gabe (yes Gabe, he has fans deal with it) only has a few pets but makes diff vids.
*Pugpibblehedgie ( basically only has hedgehogs and hamsters and her enclosures are beautiful)
*Loris hartland (doesn’t have a ton but cares for and upgrades her current setups)
*imees world (mostly rats I think but cares for them)
If you guys have such a problem with channels getting tons of animals for views, then watch channels who you think do give good care & time To the pets they already have.
The problem is that it always devolves into getting new animals. Sooner or later they all end up biting off more than they can chew. The old pets don't bring in the views, they run out of care ideas, the 'all my pets videos' are popular.
This is the direct result of being a 'pettuber', aka using your own animals to profit.
If you want to support animal channels on youtube, the better ones are educational channels or wildlife channels that don't involve 'pets' at all.
Re-read the thread. Learn to type the word 'you' and 'to' and stop stanning.
Her ferrets cage is very small. The bare minimum. She does not have that much in there for them.
With the amount of animals she has there are not enough hours in the day to give them all the time/interaction they need.
She wants to add to this number with a dog, another toucan and she already has two more mystery animals in addition to all the unseen animals that Danny hoards.
It's very clear from what she's shown us that she doesn't know a lot and her care is slipping / is now poor; eg. the bearded dragon set up, the betta fish set up.
She never owns up to mistakes (eg. I was breeding the betta so it was ok to keep them together! Despite that also being wrong).
She is not 'lame' because she's a Taylor Dean copy, she's lame because her pet care sucks balls and she's promoting it while still being told it sucks balls and doing nothing to change or improve it. She's lame because she sticks up for people like Taylor who are terrible human beings.
Ok fair enough there is no evidence that Danny’s NOT hoarding, but where is the evidence that he is? There’s having lots of pets and theres hoarding and theres a big difference.
Obviously You* havent seen the livestreams were em mentions having 3 kids so they don’t show the house and I think that’s fair because too many youtubers show too much and get no privacy.
And lastly, you still hanging on to the beta? Seriously? It’s a fish. Uv probably killed some by accident and she owned the mistake and separated them? If it was done over again I’d side with You* on that, but it’s literally the same argument. And The grinch is a Hornbill and not a toucan unles she has a toucan as well which would be stupid because that would seriously need so much space.
Seriously learn to sage.
Evidence Danny is hoarding:
-Large number of animals mentioned
-Exact number of animals not mentioned (possibly because the true number isn't known)
-Animals that should not be kept as pets, kept as pets (Wild Hornbill, Snapping Turtle)
-Large number of cages shown behind Em and Danny in Younow streams, we know more animals are kept in the basement
-Breeding of animals (snakes)
-Attempted breeding of animals (doves)
-Refusal to show animals cages/enclosures
There's probably more, but there's a lot of red flags there.
As far as the 3 kids goes, they're not there all the time and I'm sure no one here is expecting them to either a. show the kids on youtube or b. show their entire living arrangements. However if you're hiding parts of your animal keeping, ie. not showing all your animals, mentioning all your animals and not showing enclosures. People are rightly going to think you're up to something.
*You're right about it being a Hornbill not a Toucan. Toucan was mentioned somewhere above so it stuck. Hornbills also need space though, at least twice the size of the cage she currently imprisons it in. This was originally a wild bird, so my heart goes out to it… the least it could be kept in now is something more appropriate for it.
As far as the fish goes… I absolutely care about the betta. I keep betta and they're wonderful personable little fish. It's disgusting that the US sells them in little cups on shelves like they're a toy. She didn't own up to her mistake and she made /lots/ in that video. More than even most amateur fish keepers. She put an unconditioned female with a male. She tried to breed them with clearly no experience in the area. She lied about having experience (because it doesn't take a generous to know that there needs to be a bubble nest for the offspring to have any chance at surviving). She didn't cycle the tank. The tank had too strong of a flow. And of course she put them together in the first place! She was an idiot. She still is.
Also anon… no, I've never killed a fish by 'accident' or on purpose for that matter.
Accidents do happen, they happen to a lot of great fish keepers out there, but this was negligence on her part. She couldn't even be bothered to do a 2 min google search.
But again, with the hording and red flags thats all speculation. It’s the same with practically all the pettubers. We don’t/can’t know what actually goes on for real because we literally don’t know them. What if even (IMO) the best pettuber (Dark Den) smoked pot or cocaine in his house around animals? We wouldn’t know.
And what if HappyTails actually has people employed on her farm to help?
And what if Tyler Rugge actually used the dumpster dive crap which was out of date?
And what if Em literally sits in her house and kicks her animals around and is only doing Youtube for fame?
We literally don’t know?
So because we don't know 100% we can't be suspicious and speculate? We can't extrapolate what we know about the poor care already shown? lol Right.
Read this thread. Em has done plenty of shit stuff on camera. You don't need to reach that far to say Danny is a hoarder and Em doesn't know what she's talking about.
Yeah she’s done stuff that I don’t like, like saying she’s going to feed her dove eggs to her lizard, but I try to think why and I guess u can’t keep doves lonely because it’s cruel. So she should keep them in cages next to each other? Let them go??
I am personally only a fan of Dark Den and Tyler Rugge because there aren’t that many Male pettubers aside from Brian (who for me is the worst because of having a massive breeding business and the weird controversy with Em a few years ago) but I am still excited and watch because I think all youtubers in gaming and every category get better on the platform and grow into better channels, so I’m hoping these are learning years for the pettubers.
What are you talking about? She should get a bigger cage for her doves not separate them. She shouldn't plan on raising the offspring and keeping yet more doves. There's no big problem with feeding the eggs to a monitor lizard as far as I'm aware.
Pettubers are getting worse, not better imho. Tyler has his own issues that I'm sure someone else can fill you in on. Brian is notably bad for numerous reasons too, not just breeding but sick animals / parasites on animals etc.
What the hell is that dove argument? She keeps her doves together which is fine, but is allowing them to breed which is questionable - correct me if I'm wrong (this is mainly from my experience with budgies) but they need a nesting box to actually lay eggs.
I like Em as much as the next person but she is becoming problematic
And for being a pervert. He had his controversy about 1-2 years ago where he was sending dicpics to fans. His twitter got hacked for 2 days and lots of his DMs were shared.
Em got asked on a livestream about if she would collab with Brian and she said no because they have negative history. I don’t know if it’s sexual ((vom)) but she said that they (Danny Em Brian) used to be friends - which I’ve seen evidence of on Danny’s Youtube - nd that they arent on good terms with him anymore. She mentioned not wanting to talk to or see Brian or collab with specifically him and prehistoric pets, but prehistoric pets was more about obease snakes I think.
As far as Tyler is concerned I think he’s benign because he’s just a kid looking for fame. It annoys the shit out of me when he sucks up to Taylor tho. He’s literally her lapdog which sucks.
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Can u keep doves and not let them breed? As far as I know they have a nest box. She showed it in her Grinchy update Video
That is not a good nest box. It's literally a crate with nothing in it. She showed this and a pathetic few things the doves had managed to get to try and nest build.
I feel so sorry for them.
And yes, you just don't let the eggs hatch. Freeze them / dispose of them some other way, just don't let the doves nest on them.
fish are capable of feeling pain and stress its been proven over and over again, she neglected their needs and inflicted pain (ammonia build up burning their skin + probable fin nipping from stress + nipping eachother due to their aggressive nature) and stress on them. stop defending animal abuse because "its" a fish and we dont know everything
. ive seen more than enough neglect to not support her. the bearded dragon situation is another perfect example of neglect for an animals needs. stop stanning and stop defending animal abuse. >>553976
didnt she say shes feeding any eggs to her lizards? why is she purposefully hatching a chick when the enclosure is already pretty small and sad looking for 2 doves oh my god
Sadly she said she wants two more doves to do animal 'education' shows with. After that she was planning on feeding other eggs produced to an (unseen) monitor lizard.
Of course… it's also entirely likely she won't and she'll let them breed more.
The crate doesn’t bother me because I think thats better than a best you can buy from the store. It has high sides and probably makes the mom feel safe.
Also if you keep two birds together they’re going to breed. There’s no way really to stop them unless u constantly separate them to stop them having sex?? You can’t neuter so the only option is to separate. But then the females can still lay eggs.
I don’t think em should be feeding the eggs to her other animals. It makes her seem less caring that she could do that to an egg produced by her own doves. She could just buy them from a store?
I don’t think she has a monitor. She said in livestream that the eggs are being fed to the Tegu. Maybe u mixed that up??
Not saying ur wrong because there’s no proof they don’t have a monitor tho.
The crate isn't the best as they both can't even fit in it, and one bird alone struggles to. They also can't effectively nest build in it. Not that they're even given good materials to do so (from what we've seen).
A female is going to lay eggs regardless as to if they're fertile or not. Much like a chicken.
She should be disposing of the eggs somehow, it's actually fairly ethical to use them as another food source for her other animals. The egg would otherwise be wasted and thrown away.>>553986
My bad, I could have sworn she said monitor maybe in her youtube vids. I'd have to double check.
Yeah but it sends out the wrong message that she can just feed off the embryos of an animal she loves. It’s not the biggest issue in the world or anything but i think it’s disappointing because there are alternatives to using her doves eggs (like buying quail eggs) and she didn’t have to even mention it.
I don’t see anything wrong with having a dove for educational programs other than potential inbreeding if she keeps it with the parents?
The problem is she's breeding animals when she has two perfectly good animals to use as education ambassadors or whatever you want to call them.
There is literally no need to produce more because you want to have a bird you can work every day of the week.
As far as it sending the wrong message to feed eggs of her doves. Anon you're a retard.
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Firstly, don’t call me a retard - I didn’t call u one for all your speculation and FYI they do have materials.
So you’ve claimed they have toucans, a monitor and no nesting material and I debunked u on all of that. Are all *your posts just total shit??
On a different note, this cage does seem small but it’s not bad IMO. Maddie has a twitter of her intended cage today. It’s literally a dog crate. Can’t wait to see how that goes.
$2 says Tyler also gets pigeons too.
Oh anon… you are a retard.
You haven't debunked anything, one tiny trough half full of straw is a pathetic amount of nesting material for that box down there. It's not 'good materials' as I said.
The cage is too small, it's a shit cage. Other peoples care being worse doesn't change that.
I literally linked a video where she says monitor lizards… as in more than one.
And yes, I said Toucan instead of Hornbill, shoot me, someone else called it that first here and it stuck. I also admitted that as soon as you pointed it out. However that doesn't take away from the fact that its enclosure is also too small. Or any of the other criticisms. >>553999
Get back to the TND thread if you're not going to be objective. I hear they were flipping out over if she was fat or not.
Well also as a fellow vegan I would say that it’s wrong to feed off ur PET doves eggs. It’s insensitive because the eggs come from one of her most liked (IMO) animals.
I hope she doesn’t become a backyard breeder, because that would honestly break my heart to see her do that. There aren’t any babies yet tho so there’s still hope I think. I still like her and I think she’s a good person but the egg thing does get to me.
Anon… there are two options.
Destroy the dove eggs (smash them, freeze them, burn them, eat them etc etc etc etc)
Hatch the dove eggs and become a BYB.
So you think she should throw them away instead of putting them to some use as food?
Ok no derailing.
Maybe she’s just got bad luck with eggs - animals and human.
Sage for speculating about infertility. I think that’s why she’s (presumed) in the UK.
Wow anon, her animal care is fucked and I don't like her as a person but that's a bit much. She had a miscarriage… she talked openly about it.
Also you didn't sage… again.
People feed off offspring of their pets all the time. In fact, many in the snake trade have pet rats and mice that they breed for feeders. They treat them like pets, but their offspring is food.
People with pet chickens eat the eggs themselves a lot of the time.
It is what it is.
What is with all these pet tubers and their lips?
Also, by the way she just handles her pets around, you already know she has them just to try to get popular too because she lacks other talents
The minimum is because a lot of people fly their pigeons outside. They'll do loops of 8 over the buildings they're kept in. However if they're going to be in the cage for most of the time; dog crate sized is too small. Em's cage is too small. >>554182
And most parrot cages are far far far too small. Any good parrot owner will tell you that. >>554191
No, she stated it was theirs and it lived in the basement. She also does not have a job where she shows animals like she did in the UK. She's also said this. >>554148
There is no comprehensive list because she's already said that Danny has a 'vast' collection of animals that won't be shown on camera. Ironically her last video seems to only be repeating points she made before in that she wouldn't be showing all the species owned.
What is with all these questions that have been answered before? All this stanning for Emzotic. Did some fan somewhere link the thread?
Good outdoor enclosures for pigeons/doves:
Good indoor cages for pigeons/doves:
As you can see there's a lot of variation and a lot of 'hand made' cages. It's understandable if you don't want to keep your birds outside when there are lots of natural predators… however what's not understandable is why half of the room their in wasn't secured and dedicated to the doves. We all know a raccoon got in there already; it needs securing full stop. But half of that space would have made a lovely indoor aviary for those birds; not the sad little cage they ended up in.
If you think that those cages are anywhere near doable for just about anyone, you've lost your damn mind lmao. It's a good aim for "perfection" but those are probably sanctuaries, not the average keeper obviously.
It's not safe to fly domestic pigeons outside because they are easily predatorized by hawks and raccoons. No one who actually cares about their pet pigeons would ever free fly them because of the risk.
People who race their birds typically keep them in dirty lofts and don't give a shit about their animals and don't give them veterinary care.
I work at a vet and we got in a racing pigeon that was struck by a hawk, we contacted the breeder based on the leg band and the breeder told us to put it in a Pringles can and close the lid… totally fucked.
I don't know the dimensions of Em's cage, so I can't tell you if it's too small but according to Palomacy (http://www.pigeonrescue.org/faqs-2/how-to-choose-a-cage-for-pigeons-or-doves/
) which is a pretty reputable site fo pet pigeon and dove information-
Dove mated pair cage minimum; (32" x 32" x 21") and Em's cage /seems/ bigger than that.
Pigeon mated pair cage minimum; (42" x 27" x 30") and Maddie said her cage is 54".
We don't really know how often they have their birds out, but imo they should be out most of the time if possible. As long as they're at minimum, it seems fine if they're out all of the time because they're not spending really any time inside of the cage.
FYI they're not sanctuaries and they're absolutely doable. I'm not saying pigeon fanciers who race are better; only that that is often the cited reason for small cages. Did you miss the part also where I said it would be better if she'd used half of the room they're currently in and secured it? That's a pretty easy fix for a large cage.
Minimums are often shit…
Think of hamsters, little billy going to the store with his mom. They buy the biggest hamster cage there and a hamster… but even the biggest cage there to many knowledgeable hamster owners is tiny. Too small even if it's the 'minimum required size'.
The US has the shittiest minimums for pet cages as well. I'm not saying she has to build an outdoor aviary, but she needs to do better than the minimum.
>We don't really know how often they have their birds out, but imo they should be out most of the time if possible.
She has too many pets for them to be out most of the time. The ferrets should be out most of the time if kept in the sized cage they are… you'd be an idiot to have both out at the same time. Not to mention the other animals they have; including apparently monitor lizards. Therefore they can't be out most of the time, or even a good portion of the time. It's not a reach to expect them to spend 80% of their day in that cage.>>554274
All of those cages by default have a lot of floor space, which yes is important along with platforms. Note Em's cage has a lot of height, minimal floor space and perches (not shelves). That is why those cages are better.
Dove and pigeon are terms used interchangeably. Their care isn't that different barring the fact that most people agree doves need more cage space than pigeons (which is ironic). They still need floor space and they still utilise ledges.
Also you mentioned both Maddie and Em???
When I was talking about the floor space, I was talking about the pigeons.
Around where I live, we don't really use the terms interchangeably so that's probably why I was confused.
But I agree with you, it would've been nice to see Em turn the big open space into something for her birds.
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Just to give you an example anon; the common town pigeons you see around cities etc. they're called 'Rock Doves'. You likely use it interchangeably and don't even know. Most people don't and think that white = dove.
But yeah, the sad thing is Em has the means, she just doesn't want to… the pigeons and the crab were (by her own admission) impulse buys. It seems to me it wasn't even well thought through where they would go. Which brings us all back to the original problem with pettubers; in that they have too many damn animals to provide a good basis of care to each one.>>554287
Cages literally right next to each other too. With the doves occasionally landing on the ferrets cage.
Why do you keep bringing Maddie up? There were a lot of Maddie stans in this thread earlier too.
Doesn't she have like 30+ pets, BYB rats without knowing their genetic line (and so risking things like mega colon), and shills herself as some kind of pet rehabber (so she can have more animals) while doing so?
Implying anons haven't.
Also that's what this thread is for… discussing pet youtubers and their shit care.
Maddie has mentioned before that she takes all of her rat litters to the vet before adopting them out.
She's apart of a lot of rat breeding groups I'm in on Facebook and she's pretty highly regarded there with other breeders it seems.
Because she's not a licenced rat breeder. She's not listed on the AFRMA or the NFRA. Her rats show traits that can be linked to high white but it's never mentioned. She also says in one of her videos that she has too many baby rats and isn't naming them so she can sell them/give them away. That's the sign of a bad breeder. Ratteries shouldn't be overrun with litters; good ratteries produce to demand; only breed their does once or twice in the lives (over the age of months but before the age of 1 year). She might not be the worst BYB but she is one.
Again more stanning for her. She has 30+ pets that aren't there for rehabilitation. The number of pets she owns is only growing.