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No. 2243940
Trump intends to pass major tariffs against China and other countries in an attempt to shore up American manufacturing, in effect this means a wide variety of goods will likely become significantly more expensive in the future. This thread is to help nonas plan and coordinate purchases in advance of the tariffs.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/trump-favors-huge-new-tariffs-how-do-they-work
>60% tariff on Chinese goods>20% tariff on goods from anywhere else>plan to repeal CHIPS actElectronics in particular are expected to be worst hit. Gamer nonnies get your rigs built now.
No. 2244055
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>>2244015Gold and silver.
No. 2244128
>>2244119It's bad because the industry
literally doesn't exist. There is nothing to stimulate or protect.
No. 2244133
>>2244119Nations have different lifespans than humans. "In the short term" for a nation could be like 10 years, 10 years for a person is a long time. 5 bad years are enough to prevent a person from ever financially recovering. The time to stop Free Trade was in the 80s and 90s. The factories are gone and the expertise and experience is gone, and these were things developed over the course of years if not decades. And now we need to rebuild from scratch.
If you're gonna impose these tariffs they should at least be paired with massive subsidies for domestic production to speed up development and cushion the cost for consumers but I'm skeptical that will happen.
No. 2244149
>>2244119Well
nonnie, the famous republican president who historically fucked your country over called Ronald Reagan, the guy Trump is hardcore skinwalking, offshored all manufacturing jobs because rich businessmen wanted to get even richer and the stupid middle class bought into the trickle down lie. Now that those industry jobs have been moved away from the US into China and they're not coming back. Nobody is planning to bring them back. It would be too expensive to pay an American minimum wage, even with those tariffs it's still much cheaper to produce them in a sweatshop in Bangladesh. There's no expertise for those jobs left in the country. And with 60% and 20% tariffs it's going to start a global trade war so other countries will slap huge imports on US products too, something that already happened during Trump's first presidency. The tariffs that are collected from imports are used to fund all the tax cuts to the 1% they promised them.
No. 2244174
>>2244149People are also just used to the cost of goods made abroad. They did used to have to pay American minimum wages. People owned less. It will be extremely hard to get them used to what it should actually cost to buy locally made goods after decades of cheap slop.
We really have to hope this doesn't get enacted.
No. 2244389
>>2244119There are industries that have zero or very limited infrastructure and capital for 100% domestic production. It could easily take years and years, possibly decades depending on the industry to build that kind of infrastructure, develop the human capital necessary to contribute to that industry, and to make it sustainable over the long run, assuming it's even logistically possible since Trump wants to put a 20% tariff on literally everything and realistically America as a country can only produce so much by itself. Meanwhile, all goods become more expensive for everyone because
1. importers and producers who rely on imports (for example, raw materials) will pass the the tariff onto consumers
2. even if a good or service is 100% domestic it will skyrocket in demand in response to the tariffs, making it more expensive anyways
3. smaller businesses that rely on imports will heavily struggle or die
4. even if we succeed in making certain industries 100% domestic it will lead to more expensive goods and services anyways because labor costs in America are higher than abroad
This isn't even including the fact that other countries can introduce retaliatory tariffs which harm American exports
All of this heavily affects lower-income/"middle class" Americans more, because they spend a larger portion of their income on actually purchasing goods and services, while the wealthy tend to either save or purchase assets (such as stock or real estate). Elon Musk, one of Trump's biggest dickriders, flat out admitted that Trump's policies will crash the economy, but that's what he wants, because he wants a "reset" that will lead to a new economy with fewer regulations. So the wealthy are more than happy to sacrifice everyone else's prosperity since they are able to coast through the difficult economic times, and are unabashedly admitting to it openly.
Trump's entire campaign complained about "inflation" but ironically enough one of his main proposed economic policies will objectively lead to more inflation. He has tried to introduce another major policy, abolishing the federal income tax, to try to compensate for this but once again that disproportionately benefits the wealthy (more specifically high income earners) over everyone else because they pay significantly more in taxes, lower-income individuals will barely even be affected by it being abolished.
Putting all of this together the idea that Trump is in it for the working class is completely laughable. What few actual economic policies he has actually elaborated on are always tailored to favor the wealthy or the elite over everyone else. Yet despite this all, Trump is "good for the economy", whatever that is supposed to mean.
No. 2245056
>>2244015Anything you can sell at a markup, is easy to store and ship, and appeals to a wide audience. Basically, what
>>2244052 said. Stock up on pins and acrylic goods like keychains, which cost a lot more to produce in the USA, plus boxes, mailers, anything like that.
>>2244389Absolutely this. It's going to completely fuck the economy over and everyone but the super wealthy will be fucked over alongside it.
No. 2245689
>>2245084He wont be sworn in for like three months and it will take a whe before he can actually impose tariffs
>>2245056I’m pretty sure most bubble mailers are also imported from China so yeah
No. 2246188
>>2246171I would like to clarify that they first thought it was retinitis pigmentosa, but the yearly check up is to tell if its progressive or benign. I had no progression in the last 6 months, but because RP specifically is so unknown, it's difficult to tell if its just very slow or just benign. I am 21, they only detected this now because my mom asked for a full comprehensive eye exam before vision care ends at 21. I am genuinely terrified in case this is progressive, because treatments were going so well, but now I'm worried trumps policies and whatnot may cut funds for said research for these diseases. I hope it isnt progressive, but the eye doctor said if the genetics come back inconclusive they won't know what it is and all that can tell is the checkups, which is why it's crucial for me to go to them. I can't move, all my previous doctors and all my history is here, all my family. If the eye disease is progressive, there is nowhere else I can go if I end up blind, my mom and the rest of the family is here, and they were all born here.
No. 2246646
>>2244666your graphics card
>>2246029>move to an english speaking country for ease of transition>look at the countries who's money isnt as strong as the us dollarpick one
No. 2246742
>>2246647there's basically no downside to being cautious and making purchases you would have made anyway early in the event the tariffs
do pass. I hope he forgets about this.
No. 2247109
>>2246020 i'm in alaska and feel your pain. it's so fucking expensive to live here already, with trump imposing tariffs i'm going to have to just order shit to my parents house in the midwest and have them send it USPS flat rate lol. that is if he doesn't continue to gut the USPS. fuccccckkk i barely got through the first four years, how the fuck are we going to get through another four
>>2244389 great explanation, i hope you work in education
nonny No. 2247130
>>2246753I think a lot of people would be OK with a more autarkic economy
in theory it's just the getting there that's gonna be real tough. It will be years of making do with shitty prices hoping for domestic production to gear up and stabilize.
>>2247109What keeps you in Alaska?
No. 2247384
>>2244672Horrible environmental impacts were one,
nonnie. Rivers used to catch on fire they were so polluted. See China, India today…>>2244119
No. 2247423
>>2247384True. Pollution was so bad that by 1970s there were several major environmental scandals
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_Canalhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kin-Buc_Landfillhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valley_of_the_DrumsLove Canal is particularly interesting because it was an environmental justice campaign ran almost entirely by women.
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Jodi I have a job for you
No. 2247987
>>2243940This. And i don't want to fearmonger more, but as a 3rd worlder I have already lived through something similar so i have a few points that i want to add:
1) The industry that suffers the most from this it's the healthcare industry, both animal and human. Medications, goods, appliances, repairs, exty, every part of this it's either wholly outsourced and no one remembers how to do it anymore or the components needed to develop it come from different parts of the world with different patents. Simple things like syringes or common medications might be fine, anything more complex like ncu units & equipment or repair and maintenance CT scanners, no.
And if animal healthcare lacks, you become extra vulnerable to zoonotic diseases. fun stuff.
3) the second biggest
victim are the semi-industrial & medium sized electronics. There will always be a black market for phone and laptop parts, but if you need something larger than a tablet or specific tools you're out of luck.
2) everyone wants to sell cheap & easy things to manufacture and can hit the markets quickly. Plastic cups, cheap toys, bullshit like that. No one wants to do the heavy lifting and manufacture vital but not easly selleable things. I won't worry about kawiwi shit or makeup, but the manofacturing of The Specific Bolt That NCU Units Use is a less attractive market.
4) Repairmen become gods among men even if half of their jobs is just wonkly patch things up so they they survive a couple more weeks. The ability to prevent hindances goes out of the window, you don't know how badly things can get until it happen
5) The industry begins to lag and stagnate because most efforts are made to repair, maintain and produce things that already exist instead of manufacturing new things. This is how China gets several times better than you.
No. 2250363
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>>2250006Oh fuck. This is the worst way to find out about it.
https://nitter.poast.org/PFH_Blossom/ No. 2251839
I need to vent/bitch about this since I do home remodels. I was just at Pacific Sales, I know they're owned by Best Buy, but there's already a sign on the door that they're increasing prices on products starting January 1st. It's entirely possible they're taking advantage and gouging, since this is all just under the expectation tariffs will be imposed, not after the fact. Point being:
I cannot stress enough that if you were THINKING about getting a new appliance, fridge, washing machine, microwave, ANYTHING - oh my god buy it now. They'll hike prices and use tariffs as an excuse whether they pass or not. Lock in a price now just to have it and make sure you own it. It may not be an immediately visible increase across the board - it'll depend on the brand - but prices will increase due to a lot of individual parts inside appliances needing to be imported. Whether that's heating elements, motors, light bulbs, heatsinks in lights, power cables, water dispensers, small plastic housings, etc etc etc, even if it's assembled in the US, those parts have to come from somewhere. This would also hit any imports that show up in Home Depot or really any hardware store. Drywall mud made in China, cabinet hardware, sprays, foams, rough-in boxes for wall sockets, electrical parts - all of it will just be more expensive even if it's negligible. I genuinely hope he doesn't target the EU because that can also affect slab yards (a lot of tile and countertops come from Italy/Spain) and most luxury furniture.
If you have low-IQ family members who seriously think a tariff is a one-way tax on China, the easiest way to explain it to them is that it's a payment AT PORT WHEN THE PRODUCT ARRIVES, not just a magical annual tax bill to Xi. That product, on arrival, is now some % more expensive both ways. The company making it now has to make up that difference because they're paying to import in the first place. The consumer eats the cost because they can't stay in business by just paying more in general with nothing to bolster sales. There's no way on Earth it'll lead to more American manufacturing in a reasonable amount of time, since outsourcing for electronics especially became so popular decades ago, it became a standard.
>>2244389 is a very good explanation overall as to why it won't work. Some companies might pull it off if they already have good vertical integration - as in, also owning companies that get the raw materials - but most won't. This is a good post
>>2247987 repealing the CHIPS act is fucking dumb because that means little Timmy's gaming rig is easily a few grand more expensive with less options for what to even put in it.
Another slightly worrying knock-on effect is if he imposes tariffs, it's possible companies will just close business or merge since they won't be able to stay afloat anyway. Buying power goes down, people hold off on doing repairs/remodels, the already-expensive oven is now $1k more… so people just don't buy. Companies shutting down and closing overseas factories also means less jobs in that country. It'll hit everyone in different ways and it's not great.
>>2250735It's worth noting that a lot of outsourcing to China is because they have very lax laws on chemical dumping and little punishment for poor factory conditions. As
>>2250973 said, we were already making things kinda
toxic, it had real consequences, so we sent it away so someone else could make it. China sortof doesn't have an EPA, and a lot of punishment for poor environmental conditions doesn't extend to rural areas or facilities that the government is quiet about. They'll show and save face for US news outlets, but the reality is pretty grim in actual factory floors. There's a good reason that poor quality is hidden from easy at-home scrutiny.
No. 2251854
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>>2244119>>2250735Issue is, even if we magically did get countless of factories to pop up tomorrow and enough workers to work them daily, there are some resources that are just not available in our region. We don't have all types of rare earth deposits here. Even if we did start mining them again, like
>>2250973 said, people were pissed because it poisoned our water supplies. We could make lithium molybdenum oxide batteries here again but it'll ruin our environment - hence why Trump/Musk/etc want to get rid of environmental regulations. Because we have it so good now, no one remembers the nasty smog that engulfed cities back in the day.
No. 2258885
>>2250014Press(wo)man here! You're right; because of the cost of shipping for paper, it's much cheaper to make right here in the states.
As far as ink goes, we have ink manufacturers here. What becomes an issue are the components to make it: dye and pigment. Some are in-house; some are imported. Dye based inks don't last long and might fade/eat through the paper. Pigments can be synthetically made, but that comes down to, yet again, the possibility of exported components.
At the absolute worst, we'll have no shortage of paper goods.
No. 2259005
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>>2244119If Trump cared about bringing back domestic manufacturing, he wouldn’t be repealing the CHIPS act. The explicit purpose of the CHIPS act is to invest in US high tech sectors to lessen our dependence on China. Why he wants to repeal this act, I have no clue. CHIPS act would be great for the economy and National security, but I guess Biden touched it so it’s bad.
No. 2259600
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This is so disheartening to read about as a college student. I thought the economy will be in a relatively stable condition after I graduate but it seems like the tariffs are going to fuck people up for at least a decade. I wish I had a stable job so I can at least invest in items to possibly resell but I'm too poor and busy to think about things like that.