/ot/ - off-topic

Thread pic is from
https://dailytrojan.com/2023/10/19/exploring-the-link-between-catholic-guilt-and-people-pleasing/

Great thread idea, I grew up Baptist and still struggle with unlinking my personal morality from biblical morality

I really think I deserve punishment. I really think the way I'm isolated is a message from god. I think everyone going away is what I deserve. I deserve to be thrown away because I'm a mean person. I'm a bad person and deserve every bad thing in my life.

I use the Jesus cares chat sometimes to talk and vent since ai chat can only do so much but they keep trying to convert me to Christianity

Someone said I was nice and it made me feel like shit because I'm a terrible person and also feeling like shit made me feel like shit because they were being nice and I took it so poorly.

Growing up as Muslim, I have a lot of guilt towards my hobbies, my family and myself. I feel like a walking sack of shame. I feel bad if I draw, if someone catches me listening to music, I can’t wear the clothes I actually want to wear, etc. I can’t actually bring someone home. I hate it and I blame myself for not trying hard enough to become independent. If I was independent I would have more freedom to do what I want and not live with judgmental people.

>>1919467
Samefag I talked to the jesus cares chat and they were nice but I still feel crazy and undeserving of life lol

Wow I'm evil and deserve to be alone forever thanks catholic guilt

I don't feel any guilt for whatever I'm doing now, but I'm always paranoid I'll get "caught" and be in trouble with my family if they knew I sometimes eat pork in secret or read silly BL manga. It's preventing me from acting like a norma person or trusting anyone who isn't already a super close friend. I spent a semester in a country where abrahamic religions aren't really a thing and the local population is mostly superstitious and it felt so good. I felt like a human being and I'll always hate that the pandemic ruined everything because I was supposed to stay way longer than that but couldn't. It's very frustrating but since I don't feel guilt, instead of hating or doubting myself I hate my family for being full of retarded religious sexist assholes. The end result is still the same, I can't have a love life and have to hide all my thoughts.

I don't know if it's suitable for this thread because I personally have little connection to religion at all but it's shaped my family quite a bit.
My parents themselves were not religious at all, particularly my father who was an atheist liberal who actively hated religion, but his mother, my grandmother was very catholic. When I was around 6 my parents announced they were going to divorce and she literally died of shock weeks later, and because of this they stayed married on paper until I was into my teens because it was too awkward to continue on with the divorce.
It was funny because my childhood best friend who I knew through catholic school also had parents who were seperated but not divorced for religious reasons. I barely understood divorce and such so I thought it was normal for families to be like that and that husbands and wives just lived seperately.
I also found out as an adult that my father's school had a big sexual abuse scandal during the time he attended, it was national news in his country when it broke, there's no way he wouldn't have been aware of it at the time since supposedly everyone knew that that particular priest was a pedo, and I have to wonder if that was a factor in his atheism. None of my family knows I know any of this stuff, I found it all out second hand by chance.

>>1919633
It's ok to use this thread nonna. Anyone inconvenienced by religion is welcome to post. Also those traumatized by it or just bothered

i’m a closeted exmuslim and it’s ramadan so ot means i have to fucking fake fast. i don’t mind not eating but I hate how bad my breath stinks when I can’t drink anything. I can secretly drink a little but I don’t wanna get caught and deal with the bullshit. Also I don’t mind eating 1 meal a day- I’m an interminent faster anyway but I fucking hate the idea of eating so fucking late and also being forced to eat with everyone else instead of just cooking my own meals. Gah, I cannot do this every single fucking year.

Not feeling so evil anymore. I think I was having psychosis oopsie

I have never told my mom or dad about how I got raped because they would ironically victim blame me. My mom hates me being friends with "non-believers", partying and drinking. And ever since I got raped it's like she uses it as a gotcha in arguements. As soon as I told her about getting raped she started berating me and listing everything I could've done wrong to deserve to get raped "don't walk alone", "don't party", "don't dress like that" etc. That along with my rapist being a christian who went to a catholic highschool and was in a college christian student org is what sealed the deal in me quitting being a christian.
It just sucks cause it hasn't even been a year since I got raped and she's telling me to shut up and stop talking about my trauma because it will scare away "future husband". Why would I want a husband who makes me want to hide the fact I got raped. which is exactly what she did btw, she got sexually harassed and never told my dad but told me to guilt trip me into telling her more. And when I told her to stop saying I got raped as a consequences of me sinning because it means she must've sinned too to get harassed she started lying and saying it wasn't the same then slut shaming me.
Just a miserable woman, I hate the fact that I was such a goody two shoes during highschool and never tried dating. because my first experiance is literally with my rapist and it colors everything I do, cause I don't even remember all of it cause he drugged me. Now every time I tried to have "sex" it's only to try and trigger a memory of what happened (honestly those all felt like rape too because I was high and too scared that I would actually get raped or killed if I said no).
It's shitty because I'm trying to date now during college and no one is never into me. I'm never cool enough for guys and never indie enough for girls. It feels like people only people attracted to me are my rapist and even he ghosted me when I asked him to tell me the truth about what happened. I don't even want to date out of love. I just want validation that I am beautiful and I am worthy of love outside of rapists/creeps.

>>1921112
samefagging unironically victim blaming I meant. Also adding my mom had the audacity to say it wasn't losing virginity because it wasn't PiV rape (or at least that's what I remember). Like she wouldn't be calling me a slut if I did that consensually. She used to insult me for either dressing up like a tomboy(her way of saying lesbian) or a prostitute when I was in highschool. When I got a piercing this summer she told me take it off cause it made me look gay then started bringing me up getting raped as "this is what happens when you don't listen to me". I am going out my way to marry someone athiest, I won't raise children in christianity and she will keep seething. she never let me have a single shred of individuality and she wonders why I'm so childish compared to people my age. I have never had a boyfriend at 22 but she keeps pressuring me to get a husband fuck her.

>>1921119

I don’t know why but I think you are going to make it and have a truly wonderful life. Fwiw!

I think a lot of you might be interested in feminismandreligion.com, it's a great resources, featuring older feminist figures and academics tackling the subject of spirituality and faith through feminist interpretations and readings.

>>1935981
Thanks for sharing, this is my kind of thing

I grew up christian and my parents forced me to celebrate every rite of christian passage, I didn't want to, 20 years late I still think about what the fuck was in my mother's mind when she brought me to my pastor to "confess my sins."
I'm fuckin 8? I remember being locked in this room with a pastor because you know, children have to trust them, and he (an old man) was telling me. "Did you do something naughty, nona?"
"No?"
"Are you sure?"
"Yes?"
I was a straight A student and I passed my free time playing with dolls in my room, sure, I was a kid and made some messes here and there but never acted out on my parents, I don't do that even now.
"Are you sure sure nona? Every kid feels sorry for something!"
I had to makeup a lie to get out of that. I left the cult because that's what it is at 14 and since then I'm afraid to be locked in a room with old men and I hate to explain myself, I became avoidant. Sure, he didn't touch me or anything but being a quiet kid that eventually broke something in me and I think that not many kids were so lucky like me. Parents are literally putting children in pedo nests and then cry when the news comes out. Bleak. It should be illegal to make children "confess", fuck off.

>>1936101
Girl, the way you worded this made it sound as if he did something bad to you later on when nothing happened.
I just always said something like Oh I fought with my brother, and that was it.

>>1936137
Girl I don't need priest cock in my gut to be traumatized.
As a shy kid, being put in a locked room with an old man that was stroking my arms and saying "Did you do something bad??" over and over for an hour in complete silence and my mom being ok with it because she brought me there, being forced in these pedo arms in the name of religion and such made me totally avoidant of old men. That's when I realized that they would do anything if given the chance. I believe that if my mom wasn't on the other side of the door, by now I would be scarred deeply. I've always felt guilty because christianity was taught to us since kindergarten, teaching us that we're always guilty for some reason and if we didn't feel guilty then we weren't sacred or some shit. I'm not born guilty, priests are if they feel the need to touch children.

I feel like raising your kids religious is abusive and I'm thinking of phasing out one of my friendships because they're starting to have kids and I just don't feel comfortable imagining how future conversations would go. It's honestly stressing me out a lot, I think some people would think I'm overreacting but I've been through religious abuse and I think a lot of christian ideas are completely poisonous to children (imagine telling your baby that they are an inherently sinful creature?). I'm willing to hear other opinions about it but I'm not sure if my mind will change. The idea causes me a lot of dread. They're a weird denomination too, not as bad as pentacostals or catholics but there's definitely a bit more spice. Adults can do what they want and we don't talk about faith so it didn't bother me as much in the past but now it does.
>>1936101
I was put alone in a closed room with my pastor when I was 10 to be filmed while I explained why I was a good christian and deserved to be baptized. I was very uncomfortable but I wasn't able to verbalize to my mom why the situation scared me so I never talked about it. I'm sorry to hear you went through a similar situation, it is scary for a kid and they can sense when something is off even if nothing sexual or violent is happening. There were active pedophiles in my church that everyone knew about and did nothing to remove. My parents just warned me to stay away from them.

As a person raised christian what fucking annoyed me was parents forcing kids (from elementary to middle school) to go to sunday doctrine. I couldn't stand it, while the shit they said at doctrine was pretty inoffensive I hated the fact that kids who went to school from monday to saturday had to waste their free time sunday morning on some fucking bible story and preaching as well as mass. I stopped going to doctrine a little earlier than other kids and my parents (my religious mom especially) as well as other adults made me feel bad about it. Parents and kids could have used the free time to have fun together and instead they sent the kids to some old moldy room to listen to bible stories.

>>1936101
I'm sorry nona that's such a dark way of saying you had your first "confession" which is something that literally every christian has done, I say this as a kid who was also shy and did all the rite shits. Yeah it's stupid and I don't think children should be indoctrinated, but it's mostly harmless (unless he was a creepy bastard that touched you weird) and every kid just says they did some minor naughty thing, say a couple of prayers to atone and then go on. Adults do this too. Idk maybe it's because the pastors I had at the time (we had three kek) either visibly hated kids so they did the thing quickly or were pretty indifferent. I'm sorry it had such a strong effect on you though.

>>1936497
Now being filmed is not normal at all…

I have a question for the nonnas here who are Mormon or ex-Mormon: what's your opinion on the Mormon stories podcast? I discovered it after the Ruby Franke Mormon family thing and while I don't listen/watch all their content, I find it fascinating as someone who has absolutely no touching points to Mormonism and the interviewees are such pertinent, intelligent and sometimes wholesome people. I'd love to hear what you have to say.

>>1936497
ayrt and yes the thing that fucks you up the most is not being able to tell your parents. You know when they teach you that stranger danger? For some fucking reason if religion is involved, this stranger danger doesn't exist so your brain gets confused. When I was 8, a man tried to lure me with a box of croissants in a grocery store saying that I was cute, when my mom came to him, he said that "well, he thought I was cute!" and she told me to never come near me anymore. But that pastor could. That pastor could lock me in his room, saying to my mother that "if a children cries in a confession room is normal because they have to get used to it but they have to learn to be without their mommy", that pastor could touch me and trying to make me lie to get away.
If that pastor went further and put his dirty hands in my pants, my mom would never know because why would I vent to her? She's the one that brought me there and how I dare question my mom, right?
But the stranger danger feeling was the exact same.
"B-but nona! It was just a confession!"
NO that's not about it you woody head, it's about seeing nothing wrong with old men locking 8 year old children in their filthy room, touching them and then not letting them leave until they give a reply that satisfies Pedo Papa enough and the mother being totally okay with it, the very person that you're hardwired to seek help to can't help you.
There are no reason into indoctrinating children. There are no reason to touch children. There are no reason to lock children in a room with you. Only a deeply disturbed person think that's okay to do so.

Not sure if this belongs here or the bogus therapy thread but I'm fucking upset at the Ruby Franke & Jodi Hildebrandt situation. I hate this. NO THERAPIST SHOULD USE GOD OR CHRIST OR ANY RELIGIOUS REFERENCE AS A SOURCE. I'm so angry!!! Not sure if this has a dedicated thread, but the documents that they released where Ruby and Jodi torture the kids… Holy fuck. I am sickened. You have no idea how pathetic these people are and how full of hate they are. These kids were beaten, starved, abused, and the worst thing is that they still thought it was all their fault. I just can't… These kids were days away from dying. I'm so upset. Their lives are forever changed.

I just don't want therapists to have anything to do with religion. I went to a religious psychologist when I was a teen because my aunt told my mom to take me after telling her I was probably depressed (my aunt doesn't believe in depression, my mom didn't want me to get medicated) and the psychologist (yes, she had a real psychologist degree) used a weird combination of reiki and angelology or whatever it's called to "treat" me. Whenever we would talk she would tell me everything was my fault and that if I was feeling suicidal I should simply kill myself. I later attempted. I was like 13 or 14 and went there for maybe almost a year. I had an abusive home. I was told I would grow up just like my abusive dad. Of course what happened to me is nothing compared to all the victims that Jodi had control over. I just think this shit should be banned, period.

>>1936651
I'll never forget being a kid and one of my grade school buddies could never see us on Sunday mornings because he was forced to go to church. I was always bummed out because Sunday mornings were breakfast outside days for me. I also had a friend whose mom went to church 4 days a week. It was weird af as a kid

I've been a lesbian as long as I can remember. My aunt on my father's side used to be openly gay despite her religious upbringing. She even got married to a woman in 2014. A year ago she told me she was done pretending and following the "wrong" path. She said some vile stuff to me about being gay and how it isnt in the lords path, so we don't talk anymore.

>>1941598
I've seen comments under the new footage with people preaching godly forgiveness for the adults involved. The never ending bs cherry picking of when it's your place to judge others (and punish) vs when oops.. that's actually gods place is how kids get abused within religious families in the first place. This whole case is an example of that playing out. Punish tiny 'sins' very harshly like it's your job but then forgive the fucking massive ones in an instant because only god can judge me and word just in.. yep god approves!

Where was the 'only god can judge' when these kids were having their imaginary sins tortured right out of them. The lack of consistency around when or whether you need to guilt/shame/torture/punish others vs when 'only god can do that/not my place to judge' is always conveniently working in the favor of criminals.

Do you think if the Internet hadn't taken off, the majority of society would be religious?

>>1941598
there is a thread >>>/snow/1006963 I was looking at the court documents linked there earlier today, the photos of the open wounds on her sons ankles are horrific

>>1941789
That's very sad to hear. It unfortunately happens to a lot of older women. I talked to a 50 year old lesbian on Jesuscares once about being same sex attracted and she told me very sad stuff too. I will never forget that interaction.

My parents sent me to a Catholic school, so I grew up as a catholic. Something that did give me trauma was when I began my period. My mom is a christian and when I asked her why this is happening, she told me it's because women are being punished for when eve took the apple. What the hell kind of explanation is that for a scared child that wants to know what's going on with her body? It seems to be a common response and it's so messed up, when in reality it's just monthly shedding of the uterus. I thought the bleeding was punishment and wasn't explained anymore than that. It still makes me upset to think about. I was so vulnerable at that time.

I stopped calling myself christian years ago partly because of the misogyny and hate for women. At that point I was already a "lukewarm christian" that didn't go to church. I didn't look at the bible much either, but when I did I was shocked. I thought, why would a supposed loving god be punishing me? I didn't want to be hated or seen as lesser because I was a woman. It took a while to fully let go of christianity because the guilt, "going to hell" thing, and christians saying that if doing something "makes you feel good" then it's the devil deceiving you. I've moved on to paganism which gives me more comfort, and at least they celebrate menstrual cycles and women's phases in life.

>>1936101
I had something similar happen. I went to a catholic school and my class went on this "religious retreat" to another church, and one of the activities was everyone going to the confession box. I think I was 11 or 12. Anyways, I froze and had no idea what to say. The priest kept insisting that everyone sinned and I had to have something to talk about. He made me stay until I mentioned fighting with a sibling. He seemed annoyed that I didn't talk more, but he finally let me leave. It's weird to ask children to do something like that.

>>1936101
I’ve always found confession weird, I never saw the point in confessing my supposed sins to a priest because god knows everything anyway. It’s just a way for nosy priests to get dirt on church goers.

>>1942359
It was definitely a huge set back for me. Luckily I was already in my late 20s when we stopped talking, but I can imagine the impact it would have had a younger lesbian. Lesbians dont have any real role models or women to look up to, not really… It's unfortunate when you feel like your own family turns on you for being gay.