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No. 420991
Share tips, vent, advice, similar experiences, how to get out of such a rut, what can be changed, what helped you personally, where to meet women you can relate to.
This thread is for:
-those of us who spent our formative years on 4chan/other male dominated spaces and got internet poisoning from it
-those of us who realised men aren't your friends but are now alone
-gender dysphoric women especially socially dysphoric
-ex-TIFs who have come to terms with being female but are now adrift
-those of us who are gender non-conforming in personality, not only appearance
-assorted spergs/speds who have difficulty understanding social norms, unwritten rules, tone of voice, and reading between the lines
-low-empathy or low EQ women
-general loners and NEETs
This thread is NOT for humblebragging about how cool and rational and edgy you are. Please.
Previous thread:
>>314525 No. 420993
>>420795> do any other nonnas feel like they were male socialized? i'm a radfem, obviously, but i always feel insanely guilty when i see other radfems talking about women doing emotional labor for moids or dealing with sexual harassment or discrimination in the workforce because i've never dealt with any of that in any capacity.I feel the same way. I read this discussion about how women are afraid to raise their hands in the classroom because they're so insecure and all the women were talking about how annoying it was that men dominated the classroom. It made me feel really bad because I was very intellectually secure in my classes, raised my hand so much that the teacher quit calling on me so other kids got a chance, engaged with the material outside of class and wasn't afraid to take other kids (almost always males) on. I got ashamed of it at one point, like I felt I had been "male-like" and made women feel bad, so I stopped raising my hand. I don't feel like that anymore. I put in the work, I loved my classes, and I paid to have intellectual engagement. I never put down other students and always helped anyone who needed help studying. But a lot of female socializing involves trading vulnerabilities and insecurities, so I can't really join in when everyone's talking about how they felt bullied by male students. I was probably bullying the male students tbh.
I love women who are kind of "male socialized," I honestly get weak in the knees when women are intelligent and intellectually uncompromising about their positions without any female-socialized hedging or apologizing. There's so few out there because of how female socialization basically destroys your intellectual self-confidence or makes you feel like a selfish monster for being confident. Women who throw off female socialization without descending into the pits of male-typical behaviors are my favorite people on earth.
No. 421251
>>420993>I was very intellectually secure in my classes, raised my hand so much that the teacher quit calling on me so other kids got a chance, engaged with the material outside of class and wasn't afraid to take other kids (almost always males) on. I was this girl until my teachers openly bullied me into "knowing my place". Their actions left me isolated and mostly friendless. I became a troublemaker, was sent to detention and suspended multiple times, teachers hated me even more and doubled-down on punishing me. Girls avoided me because I was 'too weird'/masculine and boys either avoided me because I wasn't feminine or spoke to me like I was a boy too. The experience completely destroyed my sense of self to the point where I began ID'ing as trans.
I'm in my 30s now and have finally regained my confidence as a woman with this personality type. But I still feel like an outsider when interacting with other women at work or at social gatherings. Female co-workers have described me as 'intimidating' and 'intense' because I don't hedge my words or try to make myself small around men.
No. 421254
>>420993I relate a lot. I don't mind sharing vulnerabilities, but the sharing insecurities part is basically a social script for constant undermining of the self. Same goes for shit like acting like you're dumber/weaker than you really are, women who do this rationalize it as useful but i can't even stand the idea. This is going to sound so sappy but it goes against my ideal of dignity, and being described as competent just feels too good when it happens. On that note, i think a lot of my 'un-feminine' socialization doesn't just stem from asperger, but also from a pretty rough education. My mother grew up in rough circumstances herself and i recall how much of my early childhood was spent training to be stronger, not crying, not relying on comfort, not being so fearful (autistic aversion to the entire world), even being encouraged by my mother to brawl with problem kids as a way to show i had teeth. I still came out of it weird and a choice target for feminine bullying but it did help a lot with having a stronger personality, being recognized as someone who isn't a total pushover. The way it was done was borderline cruel but i'm still thankful for that. Ofc i still struggle with feminine socialization but i feel like i avoided some of its worst parts (like the bludgeoning of intelligence)
No. 421257
I've been trying to make more female friends but I feel like I make other women uncomfortable. I'm not sure if this is founded in reality or if it's residual guilt from being a creepy lesbian as a teenager. Not sure if im looking for advice or to just vent, since im not sure it will ever be different. I have developed a more feminine appearance to try to give off a better impression, but I feel like im too intense and strange once I open my mouth. When I try to be more forward and make the first move with women to start a friendship, im always the one initiating. If im not the one texting or making plans or paying for the outing then they never initiate and it feels so one-sided. Even if we are in person, they won't start a conversation. Theyll only respond to things i say with quick one-liners. I take this to mean that they don't like me, so why would you even come meet with me in the first place? but I had a situation happen twice that is making me wonder if that's just what theyre like: a few of my moid coworkers have a gf who they want me to befriend because "she has got to get out the house more and needs help making friends" so of course I say sure, we can have a girls day! When i meet with her, same thing. wont talk to me, wont engage with me trying to make conversation, but also doesnt try to leave until I say i need to get back home. Doesnt text me back afterwards except for "ok" "thats cool" "yeah" "oh wow", so I assume they didnt like me very much and dont text back either. But then later my coworker will talk to me and ask when our next girls day will be. I'll say something like "It was fun! She's super sweet, but I dont think we meshed very well". Then both times the moid tells me thats strange because his gf said she liked me! Then theyll tell me that she's just slow at responding because she has social anxiety. Is this normal? Am I reading too much into this? To be honest, I would like a friendship that feels equal, but is this just what normal women are like or am I making them uncomfortable and theyre just not saying anything to not hurt my feelings?
>>420993>Women who throw off female socialization without descending into the pits of male-typical behaviors are my favorite people on earth.Have you ever read mary shelley's vindication on the rights of woman? Its really good. it talks about how female socialization is an artifice or virtue meant to keep women enslaved. It is both amazing and discouraging that the issues she talks about way back then are still relatable today.
No. 421258
>>421254Samefagging because i can't delete to edit, my bad. Another thing that drives me insane is the artificial inflation of sex differences in behavior. Women do it
all the time and it's so retarded. A man will say 'i do [silly relatable thing]' and women go 'ewww i could never relate, men are so weiiird'. Why are you acting like you're part of an alien species? Another thing is the good girl LARP, complaining about the way men aren't as feminine in them in interactions. I feel like some of it is legitimate observation of misogyny, but a lot is basically 'ugh men are so rude and direct and they love to play devil's advocate'. I wish women allowed themselves to be more like that, to disagree (so-called devil's advocate), to be serious and
take themselves seriously.
No. 421295
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>>420795Me too, nonna.
>low neuroticism>low empathy>physically bullied male classmates >only learned how to do house chores when 18 years old and im still lazy when i need to do it>learned helplessness>wandered in male dominated internet spaces since early teensI don’t want to sound edgy, but I simply fake empathy and sometimes neuroticism around other women because doing otherwise is social suicide.
Unfortunately, the house chores part is one of the most annoying male traits in existence.
No. 421443
>>420993When I was in younger grades, I got bullied by my teachers (male and female) a lot and they'd turn a blind eye to boys sexually harassing me but I'd get blamed for yelling at them or throwing paper at them, and I'd get screamed at for whatever else. I remember a male teacher literally pulled the chair out from behind me and snapped at me when I tried to sit and fell down. I lived in the south so I assume racism was a part of it (I am not white) as well as me possibly being autistic, though I never got a diagnosis. Only semi related but I remember when a school counselor literally singled out my very short Indian male friend and pulled him to the front of the class and said that it was wrong to pick on people like him??? There were also a few other incidents like that, but I won't get into it.
I moved later in life and at my new school I had several very old, mean female teachers who were incredibly strict and I loved them. I honestly feel like I would have hated school if I didn't have them as teachers. They weren't easy though and they were fucking mean, but they didn't choose favorites and honestly encouraged the weird competitiveness between students, and most importantly were wonderful teachers. It helped raise my self-esteem to the point of me shitting on the other top students in those classes, who were almost always male. But I couldn't really have that kind of meanness/hate with girls.
Anyways the thing is that I couldn't really make friends with other female students who were also very smart and studious, all of them were very female socialized and in tune with feelings and such, were into stuff like musicals and Disney and I didn't care at all. Most of my truly close female friends didn't do very well in school, but I find they were far less judgmental of how I acted or my weird quirks. Even now the only female friends I can maintain actual friendships with are diagnosed autistic women. Maybe I do have autism.
No. 421459
>>421295>>421296Maybe you'd get along better with women who are naturally/culturally more stoic. I've had normalfag friends (technically house mates but we did form pretty good relationship, we hung out often and they included me in their social circles) who just learned to accept that I'm not an expressive or overly enthused person, they know I care I just can't provide the passionate reactions they might seek. This comes at the cost of me feeling like I'm not their closet friend or the first person they reach out for in crisis but I kinda made peace with that. I mean they were there for me so I think that meant they saw me as a friend right? There was still a lot of anxiety before I got comfortable enough to stop masking so hard, I think women can really pick up on that no matter how well I think I'm faking it. In return, I just do the part of being considerate about things that they care about like picking up after myself, being (somewhat) on time and listen to their mundane conversations, I think that's fair. I still haven't found that soul-deep friendship I crave but at least it kinda helps to know my cold personality isn't a deal breaker for normal women.
>>421302Online friendships are destined to die if they aren't open to hanging in voice chat every so often.
No. 421635
>>421566I think I get what you mean, anon. I haven't worn makeup and put in a ton of effort in years but whenever I did back then, I always felt ugly and out of place too. No matter how hard I tried, my makeup just always looked either too plain or too cakey compared to others, my hair somehow was always already messed up when I arrived and I never managed to find the right style for the occasion/weather/whatever. Often I put in a ridiculous amount of effort, like exfoliating right before putting on my makeup, so that my skin is perfectly and smooth and yet…? It makes me wonder how other girls somehow always manage to look put well together, how do they always know the right amount of dressing up, how does their hair not move, how are they never sweating, how are they never in a hurry, and so on…
No. 421649
>>421639Shut up and go back to your containment thread, schizo. You aren't helping.
>>421635>>421566>It makes me wonder how other girls somehow always manage to look put well togetherTake it from someone who's a newly minted normie of a few years after a lifetime of being a maladjusted autistic, the sad truth is that the really 'hot' girls put in tons of effort and money into their looks and it simply does take a lot of your time. It also takes a lot of trial and error but eventually everyone settles into their routine and knows what works for them and it gets easier from there.
>how do they always know the right amount of dressing upThey've had a lifetime of conditioning and practice, probably a mom or older sister or friends who knew, and they have a circle of friends to ask for advice. Having a fashionable relative or friend is huge. My mom is lovely but can't dress for shit, same with dad and sister. The only fashion commentary they have is 'looks nice'. Which is fine if you're happy with how you look, but I wasn't.
Another thing is most girls at some point develop a go-to outfit or uniform that they like and rewear a lot. I didn't have any of this and spent years banging my head against the wall until I found a style that I liked, felt comfy in and other people found cute too.
>how does their hair not moveHairspray and mousse, but there's also many tutorials on tiktok for updos that stay up
>how are they never sweatingAntiperspirant and showering frequently
>how are they never in a hurryMost people are, you just can't see it. If I learned anything it's that the majority of people have a lot swarming in their head but don't want to show weakness so they don't share.
I think a good place to start is find a little thing that makes you feel a tiny bit more done up and go from there. I used to hate wearing earrings until I found a flattering pair, and I used to hate my hair until I got a cute French bob. Most importantly don't compare yourself too much because you don't know who you're comparing yourself to, how much effort they put into their looks and skills, and how hard their life really is.
No. 421701
I guess I'm the one that spent my formative years on the internet and am poisoned.
I had male friends until around when puberty hits, then after that I've mostly had girl bullies that acted like friends. I have tried to be friends with women when I got out of school but there was just too much back stabbing.
30 now trying to befriend other women, but my god I can not get over this thought that they are bad in some way, will fuck me over somehow, etc… So I just don't have friends.
Has anyone been able to actually get past this? Or should I settle in to loneliness?
>>421308If I had to guess, I'd say probably a bit of both would play a role. I don't think just nature or nurture would be enough.
No. 421761
>>421308I am an autist so I think I was going to turn out non-normie no matter what. Having more caring and supportive parents likely would have made a huge difference in terms of my mental health though. I was left alone online all the time which likely exacerbated some of my more autistic traits and exposed me to too much extreme imagery. I think that likely made me more low empathy.
I agree with your assessment that introversion, lower empathy, and skepticism are defining features of a non-normie woman. Not to be an NLOG, but I feel like in all my interactions with other women, I have not met one with those particular qualities which has made for a very lonely existence for me. I can interact with people just fine but I never can establish a deep connection with anybody. My boyfriend is pretty much the only person other than my parents who I can talk to about anything.
No. 421767
>>421753I disagree. Social expectations of femininity are purely shallow and superficial. Nobody notices meek quiet submissive nice girls no matter how feminine they are. Whichever women has a) the prettiest face b) the best body and c) most attention grabbing personality is who gets lauded as the epitome of femininity.
Even tradmoids and right wing men are all thirsting over the 'hawk tuah' girl. All the Stacies at my school were loud, obnoxious, aggressive, tomboyish in behavior, honestly. But because they had pretty faces and slim-curvy feminine bodies, everyone treated them like goddesses. When you're pretty and feminine looking you're allowed to be as aggressive, hypersocial and hypersexual as you want, that's what men find hot and pay most attention to, no matter how much they whine about wanting a meek quiet church girl gf.
No. 421778
>>420795I do understand you, nona. It's difficult to be a strage autistic woman. Male autistos always have a large community, but we seem to be impossibly rare.
>the same deeply-set personality flaws as a scrote. and that's not even mentioning how even here i feel like shit because my sexuality feels anime-pornified the same way as a scrote, i love ecchishit and disproportionately large tits and shit. i can't even have an inoffensive lesbian sexuality fml. i'm not good enough to be either a man or a woman. i'm some other monstrous third gender. does anyone know wtf i'm talking aboutIts is what it is, nona, autistic woman. It must be VERY rare so its difficult to find other women like you. For me the really alienating thing is the realization how the average women are deeply masochistic. BJ chan is insane but she is right. Its just how they are. And i am more into a sadistic side. Remember these stories about trannies jerking off women's locker rooms? I feel like I am this exact thing. I don't do it obviously, but I do avoid going to public pools, for example, because I will feel like a literal predator. I guess its good that I am short and have long hair, if I was tall I would be the definition of that homophobic stereotype of predatory lesbian.
No. 421783
>>421760Yep, bumble friends, Facebook friend finder groups for my city, I'm pregnant so also now I'm on mum connection apps/ groups for my city. It all ends in the same way.
I match with people I have common interests with, start conversations around it and still nada.
I've even changed my strategy and had "I'll take cute pictures of you for you to post on instagram" in a profile since thats most of the women on here, when it's something I'm not interested in doing at all because I figured those are the girls who will actually want to meet up and do stuff/have friendships, and id like to visit aesthetic places in nature outside without personally posting it and even they one word me. I know it's a meme but I really don't think it's me.. maybe it is, I know not to be overeager but if I give the same energy they give me the conversation stops 3 messages in.
>>421757Yeah it sucks.
No. 421800
>be lonely autistic internet poisoned lesbian
>all female friendships fizzle out because i'm a retard with male hobbies and no interest in the female socialization game
>literally only friends with gay dudes, even my bestie is a gay dude
>once every five years meet one autistic woman who i connect with on a profound level
>become platonically obsessed with her, want to be her best friend, her platonic soulmate, want to do everything with her, want to give her the world
>every single goddamn time it's some bihet with a boyfriend who will always choose her scrote over me
it hurts. i wish my lesbian friends weren't so accomplished and offline, that way they could be the terminally online friend i need who i could spend every second of the day larping as their platonic gf with but alas, they have degrees. i wish i didn't get so attached to begin with, but it's so incredibly rare for me to feel this kind of connection that i go crazy. how do i stop feeling like this, how do i become more interested in the normies around me? can i even? with her i can talk about anything, and i get so bored pretending i give a fuck about makeup and jewelry and current events with regular women. i genuinely feel like a pickme but just for her, like i want her to get rid of her stupid boring guy friends and her idiot moid (that she doesn't even like) and let me be her non-romantic boyfriend. every time she's able to hang out i drop everything to spend time with her and i know i'll never be that important to her. she gives me little breadcrumbs which i think secretly adds fuel to the fire, like letting me know i'm special to her and that she loves me. fucking hell. and i know my clinginess is my problem, but i do keep all my insanity to myself and keep my distance since i'm deathly afraid of smothering her, leaving me to internalize everything and i just want to get rid of these emotions. sorry this is all over the place but i want to become normal so bad… help me, anons
No. 421837
>>421800God I didn’t think anyone else experienced this. It hurts. Down to being a terminally online lesbian, and the vapid shit most irl women are into (sorry just my opinion kek). Why do they always choose the scrotes. It’s worse when he mistreats her and then she comes crying back. I don’t know if I’m autistic or bippie or whatever but…
>>421757Is it? The best friends I’ve had always came from sharing my hobbies online, much better than the irl friends I made from school - I would ignore them for them, even.
No. 422026
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>>421755I know how you feel. I get the same shit.
Occasionally I'll just bluntly ask after a few days of one word responses why they're being so blunt and short. Granted I only have a single person who actually responded to the question, but I was told they were currently talking to over 100 people one-on-one, and even more on social media. So it might just be a lot of 'competition' so to speak, to keep up with all the chatter on the internet.
Once I get over my fear of the outdoors, I think I'll try meeting people in the wild.
No. 422062
>>421767quiet meek submissive girls
are feminine though. and im not talking about what men notice (who cares) but about making female friends and women will absolutely give you shit for being extroverted, "slutty", socially retarded, confident, extra. there is absolutely a social expectation on women (mostly imposed by other women) to be humourless, meek, passive and demure.
No. 422064
>>422062>there is absolutely a social expectation on women (mostly imposed by other women) to be humourless, meek, passive and demure.Not true at all. No woman acts meek, passive, humorless and demure unless thats her natural persoanlity OR has been enforced on her by religion/scrotes at home who check her behavior.
Bubbly sociable confident girls with an obvious sense of humor are always most popular women, even among other women. Total bs that women want other women to be serious, distant and humorless.
No. 422066
>>422064Also I would say that meek quiet introverted girls are the ones who get bullied and ostracized most by other women for being weird or thinking they're too good to join in with the socializing.
They're also the ones who get preyed on and used as doormats the most by men, often because they have less friends to give them advice or back them up, whereas popular social girls always have an army of friends who will defend them. Any women who are quiet introverted and aloof get called bitches or weirdos and are generally disliked by both women and men (except if theyre low self esteem and easier to get sex from). Look at the women moids are simping for online. They're always the most loud obnoxious attention grabbing women imaginable. Even 'conservative' moids who 'prefer feminine women' like those bold hypersocial obnoxious extroverted type women. Those women are always the most successful in life.
No. 422167
>>422144Even boomer women were more demanding than that
Wtf happened
No. 422247
>>422062ntayrt but maybe it really is a cultural thing cause where i live (burgerland) it's the total opposite, everyone prefers loud confident types and picks on quiet passive women for being "boring/weird", and the reasons
>>422066 said
No. 422250
>>420595I'm not sure where to look tbh. I guess I probably am not looking hard enough. I had looked on meetup and it seemed largely inactive in my area, but haven't really gone on Facebook or anything like that yet. when I've found cool classes - pottery, stuff like that - they're either on weekdays or they're on weekends but get booked out months ahead.
at the end of the day I know I need to make more of a solid effort, but I just feel so mentally exhausted from long work days/hour long commutes, etc.
No. 422268
>>422076I took the hoepill and decided to leverage the attention of simps for my own benefit.
If women are going to be mean to me because of my potential to steal a scrote’s resources I might as well live up to that reputation and profit from attentionwhoremaxxing. I’m not even straight so I never wanted to play this stupid game.
No. 422305
I'm not sure at what point you turn the relationship from "acquaintances" into "friends". I've joined many hobby groups/clubs where I'll meet people and get along with some, but we never cross the line into friendship and hanging out outside of the club setting. This sounds so autistic, but how do you make it clear that you want to be friends? I imagine it's not as simple as saying "Want to be friends?" like it was when you were a kid. Asking for a woman's phone number also feels so awkward to me, I feel like a creep and I don't want to push them away. They never seem to want to initiate this themselves, so I guess it's up to me. Any advice?
>>421755I have the same problem.
>>421459>Maybe you'd get along better with women who are naturally/culturally more stoicNTA but I have had a hard time finding women who are more stoic. I can be sociable, but I'm not super expressive and I've noticed it can turn women off. I've had friends in the past that understood, but it's been difficult to find people that do now.
No. 422318
I grew up having difficulty relating to other PEOPLE because both of my parents are retards, but if it helps anyone ITT, I learned how to find common ground with almost anyone through conversation and it’s helped me form friendships with very different types of women. Basically I just kind of subtly observe them a bit, how they interact, what they talk about to others, then I try to engage w them about stuff. Even if it’s stuff I’m not personally into—it helps, but it’s not super necessary? I love talking to people, and I know not everyone does, but I used to be shy and insecure til I figured out my brand of chatty if that makes sense. I’d also say I have ONE best friend, an autist like me who likes to sperg and comes off as way too aloof if she doesn’t make effort, but that doesn’t mean the less deep friendships I have w other women aren’t meaningful. Even the friend who I only talk to about the gym pretty much and at the gym, we have other overlapping interests but our personalities aren’t completely compatible for that best friend type bond. As long as there is one woman in the world other than my mother who I can hang out with and feel free, I’m happy to maybe compromise more in other friendships just for the joy of positive social interaction. If this reads as weird or lame to anyone I’m sorry kek it was how I valiantly turned around my clear cut loner arc in childhood. There’s nothing wrong w preferring one’s own company either, nor having trouble relating to other women. I just hate that there’s such a black and white mentality on both sides of like normie women and weirdo outcast women. One of my closest high school friends was the most popular girl in our grade bc it turned out she was a fucking weirdo who liked Salad Fingers and shit. We only talked bc we were next to each other in choir. Don’t lose hope of finding at least one weirdo to soul bond with, but also don’t discount other potential more light fluffy friendships! I would invite every nonna in this thread to a mixer with snacks kek
No. 422693
>>422305If the hobby group meets in person, maybe ask some people if they want to go out for food/drinks after? Make sure you ask a few, so it doesn't look like you're trying to ask someone on a date.
Granted I'm fucking autistic so this may be terrible advice.
No. 422732
>>422694If you talk shit about others people assume you will do it about them as well when they are not around. Which you are kinda doing by making this post? Also you probably come off as self centered and with a
victim mentality and this encourages these people to get together based on the common ground of disliking you and treating them as vent dumps.
There is a phenomenon where people will assign the traits you tell them other people have to you, I forgot what it's called. So if you keep talking shit about others, the person listening to you may start thinking you have the behaviors and traits you complain about. And since you complain about negative things it's likely you don't come off as a likeable person or maybe you're just extremely draining to be around because of this. I personally avoid any type of complainers altogether, it's so exhausting and unpleasant to spend time with someone who would has their mind attuned to negatives in other people. If you can't contain yourself from talking negatively about people, try not talking about them at all and talk about interests or activities instead (even if the other person wants to gossip they could be just testing you to see if you run your mouth)
No. 423234
>>422732>>422882enough with y'all
victim blaming bullshit
No. 423485
>>422732I don't shit talk about them (about their personality or interests) I just vent about how they bullied me for years and would spread lies about me so others would hate me. And btw I only vent once the other person has before or if our relationship is long enough that we feel close to do this. But I do get how I come off as draining I'm not sure what to do about this though.
But in the end I'm not really here asking for advice on how to change my personality to suit others (maybe I should) I'm just asking what I'm doing wrong and why they all ditch me for those who are known to be harmful. I know I wouldn't want to be friends with someone who did horrible shit to others, so why do they? I can't vent to a friend but they can leave me to go talk shit about me to someone else? Where is the appeal in befriending someone just because you all mutually dislike someone please tell me maybe I should get in on that and I'll make long-lasting friends for once lol.
>>422882Am I gravitating towards harmful people or are harmful people gravitating towards me? If all those I attract and gravitate to aren't a good fit how do I even go about choosing friends carefully? People only show their true colours after wronging you and then it's too late. It's all trial and error so far.
But thank you anyway nonnies. Even if you guys were a bit mean I think I probably needed a slight reality check. I need to fix my
victim mentality and move cities and all will be well.
No. 423491
>>423485nta and im sorry if this sounds mean but most people dont gaf about how shitty people are unless it affects them directly.
btw maybe your bullies are really nice to people who arent you kek and if they still dislike you for whatever reason they can just turn people against you if they're smart enough.
You should never talk shit about people who are manipulative
or in general tbh, unless you met someone REALLY shitty and have an extremely close friend , if they dont have anything against you (like talking about how they bullied you or how theyre horrible people) they'll just sound insane
No. 423538
>>423485Honestly, I think the being in a small city thing is a huge part of the issue. The other anons have good points too but I imagine the small town social setting exacerbates it. I also used to be similar to you in that I would be prone to complaining and venting to people who I thought I was close with and I learned that most people don't give a shit or would just get annoyed with me, even if it was me venting about an ex who was physically
abusive to me. I find it more effective to treat venting with a bit of light-hearted snarkiness rather than just complaining. Only an extremely close friend will tolerate full-on venting.
No. 423823
>>423491Yeah that's true. There's one girl in this city who vented to me about these same girls too, she was the only one that gaf (but she was also desperate for friends I think). Thanks for the advice
>>423538Yes being in a small city is also a major reason why I think these girls are so well off with friends too and can get away with their actions.
Because when I think about it more, people may mainly befriend them because they're scared of not being on good terms with them and having the same things being done to them. Once they hear what happened to me, they probably think they're the next target if they're around me for too long.
No. 423828
>>423485i'm
>>422882 and i wasn't trying to be mean. all i was trying to convey was that if this keeps happening to you then you're either venting too much and sabotaging your friendships or you're befriending people who aren't good for you. it's not
victim-blaming to say that sometimes the best way to break a cycle is to examine our own behavior. you have to learn how to protect yourself from shitty people because no one else can do it for you. whether you are gravitating towards these women or they are gravitating towards you doesn't really matter, what's important is that you identify their behavior early in the friendship before you start confiding in them so you don't get hurt again.
No. 424100
I am/was a loner for most of my life. Growing up, I didn't share interests with girls in school. I spent a lot of time around my older brother, so I developed a lot of the same interests as him and had more of a rough, goofy personality. I had male friends when I was young, but around puberty they all felt weird having a girl as a friend, so I ended up alone. I changed from a happy, extroverted, funny kid to a quiet daydreamer. I used to be really lonely as a child. I still remember in elementary school, I called every girl in my class to invite them to a sleepover, and they all said no. I ate lunch alone. By middle school, I was actively bullied by everyone because I was quiet and unattractive. Boys asked me out as a joke. Girls would physically and mentally abuse me. I was still an outcast in high school, but I developed an edgy personality to cope with the bullying, so I was mostly left alone by then. By college, it somehow got worse, with women starting rumors about me despite me never having interacted with them. My sin was being quiet.
I do have one friend I get along with now, but it's more of a professional relationship so I'm wary about getting too close to her. I used to yearn for close friendships, but after being distant from real people for so long, and after many failed friendships with people online, I've gotten over the desire to have friends. I also feel a lot less lonely after getting a boyfriend, even though I haven't met him in person yet. Now I just want to get married, buy a house, and start a family.
No. 424825
>>424284I’ve never enjoyed self objectification or trying to look sexy to strangers either because it requires you to look at yourself through the male gaze and I’ve never once felt any urge to do that in the slightest kek. Why would I? Honestly I think it’s a form of self flagellation and mental illness. Probably some vestigial urge to compete for resources, but the fact is most men are ugly broke trash losers not worth a damn, and the ones who are rich are also ugly, degenerates or are stingy as hell and only give you as much money as you could have made for yourself anyway, so what’s the point?
Although it sounds snobbish, I genuinely view women who go out of their way to impress and please men as being unevolved and retarded. Something is wrong with them. Men are objectively terrible creatures, and these women know it, so the same women actually going to extreme efforts to look good for them is so strange and self defeating to me. I’m not saying you have to dress like a slob, gain weight or never wear makeup, but I frankly find trying to appeal to men absolutely pathetic and will never understand the women who go so far to do it ie extreme diets and excessive gym time, dangerous plastic surgeries and body modification, wearing uncomfortable clothing, spending massive amounts of money on unnecessary grooming or procedures etc.
Notice how the women who put the most effort into looking good almost never have attractive boyfriends or husbands either, they’re always with some overweight repulsive looking schlubby soiboi or roidpig. I’ve never once seen a ‘Stacy’ with her boyfriend and thought ‘I wish I could get a guy like that’
No. 424827
>>424825Also I hate when women say ‘I’m just doing it for myself’ like yeah whatever you say lol. ‘Myself’ has become synonymous with the male voyeur living in women’s heads rent free.
The brainworms of female heterosexuality go that deep. I suppose trying to rationalize being attracted to the gender that commits nearly all sex crimes, violent crimes, terrorism, wars, etc is already so insane and a form of mental illness in itself, not surprising some women decide to go push the boat out with the pickmeism, masochism and desperation. Most people are also fucking morons and so will never analyze or deconstruct their own behavior. Pickmes and moids have that in common.
No. 425686
>>425669Retard. What do you think getting a nose job is going to get you?
Maybe some people treating you nicer or giving you more opportunities? Even with the absolute best results it’d be no different from being someone who has good connections, for example. You could sleep your way up and get similar results kek. People like you who shill abominable misogynistic practises like this are disgusting and exactly why I can’t stand normie women.
No. 425689
>>425671I wasn't talking about average looking women.
>>425686> it’d be no different from being someone who has good connectionsYou need a nice face for that.
>People like you who shill abominable misogynistic practises like this are disgusting and exactly why I can’t stand normie women.Those misogynistic practices helps mamy women to have a career, degree, job, friends, opportunities, a life. You either play this game or smell your shit. I'm not a normie also
No. 425802
>>425787>Stacies are the real victimsThis gaslighting gets old yawn
>I don't know a single Stacy who hasnt been CSA'd, abused, cheated on, raped.Do you really believe that ugly women/girls are not getting raped? Or less likely to? Wow, you must really have a fucked up mind. You're a disgusting vile person. İ hope those stacies pay you for this shit, you plain face
No. 425809
>>425802wow. you have issues. nayrt but she said literally none of that. take your meds.
>>425778>pretty privelage is the difference between a woman being treated like human and a subhumanim ugly, dont wear makeup, dont shave, and am well liked by all my coworkers, my boss, have friends, have sex and date, travel, etc etc. you sound like incels when you talk about beauty being the make or break for happiness and success in society. stop trying to validate your pathetic somatic obsession and vanity by doomposting about how ugliness ruins your life. it really doesnt.
No. 425814
>>425809>nayrt but she said literally none of thatThat what she meant.
>im ugly, dont wear makeup, dont shave, and am well liked by all my coworkers, my boss, have friends, have sex and date, travel, etc etcYou're not ugly then kek.
>you sound like incels when you talk about beauty being the make or break for happiness and success in society.It does. No amount of denial and gaslighting going to change it
>>425810>I don't know a single Stacy who hasnt been CSA'd, abused, cheated on, raped. No. 425815
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>>425814>every pretty woman I know has been raped>so you don't think ugly women get raped?esl-chan… take a nap…
No. 425816
>>425813>its also hard to relate to women who think being ugly is literally the worst thing that can ever happen to you, and spend thousands of dollars and hours of their time trying to meet a male created standard.Read the OP of this thread, not being able to relate to the <3% of all women who get ps is a non-issue, you didn't come to vent, you only want to pat yourself on the back.
>This thread is NOT for humblebragging about how cool and rational and edgy you are. Please.That sounds exactly like you.
No. 425849
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People are saying that trying to adhere to normie standards is normie shit, but unless you are a neet, you are forced to mingle with them every single day, especially if you work and go to school. I really wish i could just be myself, but i want a job and the easiest life possible. Being me is not going to get me that. I have to leave who i truly am behind closed doors, an autistic woman who truly has very little interest in others and is borderline sociopathic because empathy was always something i have to learn rather than acquire naturally. If you look at ugly women who manage to thrive, they have very good personalities, very socially capable and are pleasant people. I do not have these traits so i'd rather at least fake beauty so normies can have one less thing to bother me about, aside from the fact that i am generally just a perfectionist and i am obsessed with my image, even if i have zero intention on getting any scrote attention which may be hard to believe, but i don't blame anons for thinking that. I've always admired normie women who are as dull as a white wall but get by on just being pretty and smiling every now and then. It must be nice to live a life where nobody demands much of you. For as much as this is considered a normie problem, i've vented about dissatisfaction about my looks with normie women and they just hit you with the everybody is beautiful bullshit. I can't help but wanting doors that were always shut for me to be open. I don't care if it makes me shallow. But i am also painfully aware that if i lived on my own on a deserted island i wouldn't have these thoughts. I would love nothing more but to live in total isolation tbh, every single life problem i've ever had would just melt away. I feel like there is no solution that is viable except suicide sometimes.
No. 425901
>>425861Envy 100%. Misery loves company and they hate that you're not tied down to a post-wall scrote with kids that take up all your time and money. Even worse, you don't sound mad about it.
I worked with women like that in the past, they're the most bitter micromanaging assholes on the planet, the sort who'd be troons if they hadn't signed up to be wholesome tradwives instead. Don't bother trying to get into their good graces, be polite and friendly and ignore all the bitchy comments, because they're really just mad at themselves.
No. 425907
>>425861>They have kids, I don't, that's why they must hate/envy me!That's such a weird train of thought. And all of them too? Maybe you're just an unpleasant person to be around or a shit worker? Maybe you're not friends because you just don't share much in common and are conflating that with being disliked?
I'm not saying it's not possible, there's plenty of young mothers and older married women who're disillusioned with married life and motherhood, but without further context that explains and justifies your train of thought, it just seems like insecurity about your lifestyle from your side, not theirs.
No. 426923
>>425849I relate to this so much, please don't be so hard on yourself. The best thing you can do is embrace yourself for who you are, no amount of pretty is going to change who you are inside.
This sounds silly but I see life now almost like a rpg where I have fun playing the game of acting like a normie? I've forced myself to socialize a lot and realized that most people aren't constantly analyzing how they act and how others see them like we do. So for me, I've learned how to read people quite well and quite often if you see people need help with something or look bored/like they want to talk, they'll react positively if you offer to help/ make some lighthearted chitchat. I know you said you don't have the traits to be extremely socially capable, but I didn't think I did either. When I learned that I can actually strike up a conversation with most people quite easily my social anxiety got a lot better and I gained more confidence.
As far as appearance related stuff goes, I'm not going to deny the halo effect but if you can find a way to enjoy doing it, and making it low maintenance that will help. Like I reframed doing my hair/makeup/nails as working on a quick art project that I get to show off in public, not as something "I have to do to fix my insecurities". Same with picking out cute outfits, its like recreating a mood board irl?
Finally, I'd say one of the biggest things that turned my life around was finding ways to turn my special interests into strengths, not just quirks about me. I try to incorporate my interests into my life in ways that make me a more well rounded person, and I've made a ton of friends because they have at least one interest in common with me.
No. 427066
>>427035It's a façade, anon. Normie women are aware that shits stupid, they are just extremely performative and gaslight other women around them into believing this shit, specially if you are younger. Many
toxic (female) coworkers projected into me telling me I'm "difficult to deal with" over small reasonable requests they had to do cause the law itself said so, specially when I've tried to point out politely how full of shit they were. Stick to your Radfem friends and avoid these assholes as much as possible, they are a waste of time to deal with
No. 427068
>>425861They envy you anon, 100%. Moids nowadays are porn addict psychopaths who prey into the mass media induced paranoia normie women have of "dying alone" to secure a bang maid that makes them money, and they are just realizing they were memed into being house slave AND the bread winner to a moid they barely can stand, and that raising a kid that can talk back to you and can point out the stupid shit you do isnt like having a cat or a dog that are mostly just content with being well fed and scratches.
Just smile n nod whenever they come to you with any bullshit. Maybe learn some techniques to deal with difficult people perhaps, not worth of anyone's time.
No. 427079
>>427035>Anyone hate how self-sacrificing and "altruistic" normie women are?YES oh my god. i've always been so annoyed by this. i saw it in my family, with my mother doing everything to run the household, and my retard dad decided he was too depressed to work and quit his job. so mom is fully supporting him and working full time, paying all the bills and for the house, while also doing his laundry and bringing him meals. she still waits on both my father and my retarded brother who is 18 and refuses to get a job. my mother pays for both my brother's school and gives him the spending money he whines at her to give him. imagine living your entire life basically as an unpaid domestic laborer and also paying for your two leeches. i work & support myself obvi and i got my uni tuition to basically nothing (scholarships) and i'm so glad, because if i had to ask my mom for money i would feel so horrible. and she basically has no time or money left for herself, to do things she wants to do.
when i talk about this with my mom she tells me that i don't understand what it's like to be a wife and mother, and that she's happy to do this because she loves them so much and wants them to be happy. she really does love being a mom, but the thing that gets me is that obviously im capable of taking care of myself, and i love my mom and want HER to be happy which is why i dont fucking drain her bc im too lazy to do shit. so im like why the fuck cant they stop inconveniencing you and do stuff for your sake, and she tells me its the wife's job to take care of everybody. and she thinks that ill understand it when i get married and have kids, lmao. this just makes me really not want to do those things because i cant imagine my life and personhood just being reduced to this self-sacrificial doormat thing giving up all my freedom and dreams so i can exist to support retarded lazy incompetent men. im wondering how long this will continue bc my dad has been refusing to get a job for 1 year and my brother is shit at university and nearly failing his classes. if they intend on freeloading forever, god forbid when my mother passes away i have no idea what they will fucking do, because i sure as hell wont do this for them.
No. 427497
Why do I attract frenemies? Seriously, most friends I've had eventually tried to make me feel bad about myself for no real reason (that I can think of). Whenever I confront them all I get is 'gee anon stop being so sensitive', I can not stand it anymore. It's so immature, I'm in my twenties and I really don't know why it keeps happening because it's some high school shit. At this point I'd rather be a loner than try anymore, whenever I try I end up getting hurt. I'm so tired of being walked all over, I won't let it happen to me anymore even if I'll probably be alone forever. Moids are no company, even just one good female friend would mean the world to me. I wish my old best friend hadn't become a criminal, she knows more about me than anyone even my parents. Just to have a friendship like that again, I've been thinking about her a lot but she blocked me and probably hates me for dropping her but we had such a true connection even if it wasn't always the healthiest.
>>427414I'm so sorry anon, that sounds horrible. I guess I don't really have advice but I can imagine how much that hurts, I always thought bullying would end in adulthood but no. Can I ask what type of job it was? If it's a dead end one the people there are probably unhappy and trying to cope by taking their frustration out on you, happened to my old coworker too and me as well (I quit after half a year because I couldn't stand all the gossip and petty drama). People are fucking mean.
No. 427507
>>427062>>427066I am quite aware of that, they are like that towards other women yet with moids they are always doormats and shit, and paint themselves as oh so sacrificial. They're always sabotaging themselves.
But there's also that one brand of women I had as a friend who is always self-sacrificing without being manipulative, they always run back to their abusers or people who exploit them. They fear even being thought of as "selfish" in even one interaction.
No. 427521
>>427497Thank you nona. It is a dead end job but I just got a better job offer that pays more! The timing is crazy lol
>>427506Yeah. It says something when all the coworkers my age aren't there long. It's probably not personal but I definitely made myself an easy target.
>>427497>even if it wasn't always the healthiest. I think that's the key here. Do you get into friendships quickly?
No. 434994
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Anyone else feel like they spent too much time surrounded by retarded autistic nonsense ("those of us who spent our formative years on 4chan/other male dominated spaces and got internet poisoning from it") to truly fit in with normies but has also matured and stabilized enough to no longer relate to online losers? Like being in this limbo where you have an abnormally high awareness of the culture of rejects and degens but don't personally engage in it (anymore).
I feel awkward engaging with most people because my upbringing wasn't normal and I feel like I don't have the prerequisite context to connect with people. For instance I didn't have any friends the whole time I was growing up (early childhood thru teen years) and developed extensive knowledge of stupid niche online spergery instead of typical experiences for a girl. I am doing a lot of basic stuff, like getting lunch with a friend or even just having an extensive conversation with someone, for the first time, which is exciting but also makes me feel a lot like a fish out of water. There are a lot of times where I subtly don't fit in and come across as very puzzling or esoteric although people generally like me, because we don't relate to each other. I have a hard time knowing what to talk about because don't have a wealth of normal experiences to draw back on, so I think I end up settling on a kinda limited range of topics and not actually opening up much.
On the other hand, I have made a ton of progress in conquering my mentally ill and neurotic behaviors and I don't think I really qualify as even having any mental illnesses anymore. I am generally content with life. I am not longer a NEET (although I just have a wagie job), am in a healthy long-term relationship, and also got over all the weird and dumb sexual stuff. So I'm not in the same spiraling camp as most other people who started out like me.
It feels weird thinking about how usually people don't get out of that sort of rut, or at least I never hear about it so I have no model of reference, I guess. Mostly when I see people who were in the position I was, they just end up getting worse and worse. I want to keep improving my life but I'm struggling to adjust to normal social interaction and there have been times where I accidentally let slip something strange or stupid. Not sure how to describe this but especially around women I feel like they're so much neater and more polished than me in some nebulous figurative way, where I grew up in the gutter surrounded by filth they have zero concept of… Maybe I'm just self-conscious about it but I feel like it shows.
I guess I'm just shooting this out there to ask if anyone else is in the same boat of having been in a really dark place, not even in a profound way but just a retarded way, and crawled out of the pit?
No. 435065
>>434994Yeah, me. I despise all the pointless hate "us based weirdo autists" throw at "le normies". But I'm not exactly what you'd call a "normie" either because being an unfeminine girl in the first place, then growing up on the internet and specifically 4chan and surrounded by moid shit, has totally ruined my ability to connect with more normal women in a significant way in real life. However, that doesn't mean I should stop interacting with women or reject the idea of a friendship with them. Yes, I was bullied by the popular girls at some point but I guess I didn't become obsessed enough with that to think all women that aren't as weird as me are like that. (Plus it looks like those bullies felt bad about it later when they grew up.) There are all kinds of women in the world, not just the mean hyperfeminine normie bullies that made your life hell. There are "normie" women that are nice, there are "weird" women that are incredibly shitty people. There are "normies" that are actually just mentally ill or have severe issues in their life, and they do not represent all women.
I don't know why you all fixate so much on that normie/non-normie distinction and fight so hard to keep yourselves in a position of victimhood based around that. You might not fit society's definition of "normal" but you can overcome those difficulties and you don't even have to stop being yourself (where the fuck did this idea even come from, that to be a functional member of society you have to "become a normalfag" and give up everything you like or adopt and entirely new personality? I feel like those who actually believe this are just NEETs or new ex-NEETs that barely reach the age of 21 and rarely leave their house while staying on the internet 24/7)
No. 435070
>>434994Yeah, I relate quite a lot to what you say and I get what you mean about now feeling kind of self-conscious or awkward around women, but as cliche as it may sound the only thing you can do is work a bit on your confidence. See, most adult sane women don't overthink that much about other people. Even if you have some little quirks or say something unusual sometimes, if they like you it's fine, they probably find you interesting, cool or fun. And if they don't like you that much, it's fine too, they're going to be polite, just as you try to be polite with people you don't like that much. I did struggle with neurotic behaviors too so I know it's hard to break those patterns, but realizing that I am an ok person and that sane people don't overthink as much as I did nor make a big deal about some stupid little interaction, was relieving.
Oh, and I also realized that I have so so much more in common with any woman ("normie" or not), even if we don't share interests, than with those retarded online moids. As long as they are nice, I can feel perfectly comfortable around them now.
So yeah, it's ok to feel a bit scared around women now, but don't worry, you seem to be in a good place and you'll overcome it.
No. 435407
>>435058this is a very strangely encouraging and reassuring framing, thank you
>>435065>>435068>>435070I'm glad to hear that it resonated with some others. It's an awkward state to be in but at the end of the day I want to remember that it's a blessing that I didn't just keep sinking further and further down, it's a wonderful thing to have the opportunity to be a little awkward and work on figuring stuff out. I'm trying to kick my inclination to either think I'm totally cut off from society or overcorrect and be in denial thinking that I'm perfectly average. The balanced perspective on this I think is that I may be quite different from others in many ways but I can still connect with them in meaningful ways.
>>435071you are right but also
>Legitimately autistic/unwell girls would get crucified every other day in places like tumblr, at the hands of slightly less odd (but still mentally ill) girls.is a fairly apt description of the purpose of this site kek
No. 436355
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Long Time lurker checking in to say. I caved and took the male friends pill. Inb4 but they’re only pretending to be nice and it’s not a real friendship. Idc I will simply replace them with others if they leave. If I managed to make female friends then I do, if not then oh well. I am tired of trying.
No. 436407
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My worse barrier with befriending women is the photo taking. Especially in friend groups they want to post on social media if we're doing something fun, and I'm really self conscious on my looks nor do I want to be posted online. Especially when you know there's always creepy scrotes lurking. I get seen as strange when I try to set boundaries I just already am stepping out of my comfort level being with others it gets so overwhelming. Then my brain doesn't want me to go out anymore because I don't feel safe. It's really just a me problem because for my internships and university you get your photos taken as well and it always ruins my day.
No. 436570
>>436355>>436356I've had multiple male friends who were definitely, absolutely not attracted to me. Doesn't mean they were always excellent friends but any stupid stuff they did towards me was the same stupid stuff they'd all do to each other and that I'd do back, so it wasn't like I was being treated any differently for being a woman. A lot of guys would explicitly express that they think I'm autistic and then treat me like a dude, with all the positives and negatives of that. There are inevitably ways in which they are hopelessly separated from my experience due to being male but I get that in different ways with women, so I think I need friends of both sexes to check every social desire. I want to focus more on female friends right now however.
>>436359>I feel like i can be myself around males because I don't really care what they think as muchi relate to this, with men if they think I'm weird or get offended I don't really care. Sometimes I'll kinda gaslight them that it's not me, they just don't get it because they're male. With women I feel more pressure to be appealing to them
No. 436684
>>436666why the fuck are women like this
why even bother honestly I'm so done. Basically committing myself to celibacy and a life of isolation and self employment
I'm going back to male friend groups if I do make friends again, the weird creepy vibes I get from women are real. they talk about men being creepy but they don't know what each others real face looks like because they paint on a promotional fake face, which is some fucking dreadful dystopian novel bullshit thats I'm supposed to pretend is normal person behavior and not weird freak behavior
No. 436703
>>436684It is weird. I’m very bitter that I was lucky enough to come from a loving family with well off parents that were still together and I had to be dragged through the mud and used as a punching bag by a bunch of low class failed abortions from broken homes. My parents worked very hard to give me a good life unlike the mothers of the girls’ who bullied me who were welfare queens with a new man every few years who let’s be honest where probably just there so they can have a shot at molesting the daughters. And now those girls are doing much better than I am because they were able to purge all the filth and bile within their souls by tearing me down and they’re able to blam e all of their mistakes on their uwu bad childhood. Meanwhile people use being bullied at school as an insult. I’m just a privileged upper middle class child of loving parents so I have no excuse for being clinically depressed into my 30s. I consider myself a secondhand
victim of the disgusting welfare queens that dragged up the nasty little bitches that made my life a misery. If I ever have kids I’m not going to stand for it and if the school won’t help me (just like my school didn’t help my parents when they complained) then I will take them out and homeschool them.
No. 436712
>>436703I'm also from a "good home", my family wasn't perfect but also was far from what anyone would consider a broken home. I got bullied a lot during childhood too for no discernible reason. I'm doing alright nowadays but when I look back on my memories it seems so hellish and I'm so glad to be an adult, I've never been able to relate to those "zomg nostalgiaaa i miss being a kid it was so easy to make friends!!" sentiments that people post.
>homeschoolI don't have kids right now I'm strongly considering this if the circumstances make it possible. I think I may have some spergy tendencies by nature (based on my dad and grandpa) which I guess kids might've honed in on and targeted… Idk how little girls manage to clock tism with a hawk's eye precision when actual psychs don't notice it at all if you aren't male. I did get diagnosed with something adjacent as a teen. But based on that
(and on how my bf is diagnosed autist, he is pretty normie and well-adjusted though and mostly just loves math/languages and does benign weird stuff like sit on the ground, it's not the damaging internet rot I ended up with. he doesn't even use the internet for anything except to look at formulae and ancient greek phonology) I think there's a high chance that any kids I have will be a little different by nature, so I want them to be in an environment where they're supported both academically and socially. Of course homeschooling is a delicate topic so I'd want to put in more research and make sure I can offer something that's genuinely substantial before I decide on it.
No. 436729
The one thing I struggle with is the fact a lot of women I know in my life are high maintenance. Like they focus on stuff like makeup, getting their nails done, hair dyed, skincare routines, etc. I've had numerous friends tell me they wanna do a makeover on me, and like. It's nice, but I sometimes just want to let myself be lazy for an extended period and let my bushy eyebrows stay unplucked. My friends also just assume I'm going to be alone forever, like not directly they think so, but they've alluded to it. I also do care about my fashion choices, but when I make a bold statement, they're like "what happened to you anon?!" It's a push and pull feeling I get
No. 436799
>>436666why is there so much
femcel rhetoric in this thread. back when there was a community that identified as
femcels (as opposed to being called a false equivalent by stinky moids), all they would do is blame stacy for all of their problems and even if some were celibate, they would just wait for any run of the mill redditor to send them dick pics. i fucking hate myself as a woman and have moments of kneejerk misogynistic reactions, but pretending women are more harmful than men and men are easier to be around because they don't flaunt their degeneracy in neutral situations/communities? KEK
No. 436800
>>436799It’s my personal experience. It’s what I’ve lived through. It’s not “
femcel rhetoric”. Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable but it’s the truth.
Sorry you hate yourself for being a woman, I can’t relate to that at all. Maybe fuck off and go chop your tits off instead of trying to silence people talking about their personal experience?
Literally all I said was the social consequence of being bullied by girls is worse. “You’re saying women are more harmful!” Yes in this ONE hyper specific scenario and you call it
femcel rhetoric. Then you go on to say you hate yourself for being a woman? You’re so pathetic.
No. 436806
>>436799it's not
femcel rhetoric to admit women will bully each other in way less aggressive ways that end up having worse social consequences. you sound like one of those bully girls I had in middle school tbh. I bet if it was nowadays they would use 3rd wave feminism to bully me because I wasn't feminine enough I would be "putting down other women just because they are feminine".
No. 436936
>>436893For me it’s just, are you really surrounded by women who are only like this? Granted they make up the majority but I’ve never had trouble finding my little crew. Even my high school friend group was a clusterfuck of emos, spergy nerds, weebs and edgy imageboard users. Mostly female even. Granted none of them were exactly like me (not as autistic or GNC in personality) but I was really well-liked even. Granted now as adults, most of them are turning into normie women who cake on makeup and while alternative have lost interest in a lot of that stuff, but I’d still be able to talk and get along with them (albeit not close, best friend level) but I still have my internet friends. 90% of fandom women back in the 2000s/2010s were like this too, now it’s less but still most of the chronically online ones. I’ve met with some of them (after years and years, since I knew them in my teens) and two of them are my bestest friends ever. I just feel like you need to have the places to look, yk? There really is no reason to be alone,
although maybe in some countries it might be impossible to find irl women like thisI think better than getting along with women in day to day life, is to have a best friend. A friend group is second, and casual friends are basically unimportant. These normie women get along with everyone but I hardly see them form strong close bonds with each other - especially the women who perform for men, it’s all superficial connection based around that common interest. They throw each other under the bus all the time.
No. 436947
>>436936> are you really surrounded by women who are only like this? My point was it's a low level entry point to build a friendship. You can expand to other topics or activities over time as you become comfortable around each other. But any other easy common interest will do.
>I think better than getting along with women in day to day life, is to have a best friend.This is almost impossible to achieve these days and has too many conditions. It's better to have many casual-to-close friends than one best friend, because the chances of finding a person who fits you are very, very slim and even if you find one, if you depend only on one person as part of support system, when she flakes out or starts acting weird because autism or she got a nigel or some other bullshit, then you're left with nobody to spend time with. Best friends are too romanticized and a concept that is unattainable, especially as you become older and seeing how society is progressing it looks to me like something that exists only in novels or anime at this point. And it's really better to get along with as many people as possible, it just makes life easier.
No. 436956
>>436947>Best friends are too romanticized and a concept that is unattainableHearing this is so insane to me wow. I could never go through life without a weird woman I relate to, I’m so unlike most women I’d genuinely have committed suicide by now, 100%. Like I said I have 2 best friends and I had others as a teen/kid but these best friends I’ve had for nearly a decade. Recently I’ve met a new one I click with (through the internet again) even more than these ones and she’s moving here to London from New York so we can see each other more often kek. Maybe it’s because I used to be a NEET but I could never imagine valuing casual friends over these, maybe I’m antisocial but I’ve gone years without that and if anything I felt better.
Guess it depends on you though. If I couldn’t find friends through my interests and beliefs I would probably think similarly to you… Or maybe not. A close connection is probably my favourite thing in the world regardless and probably my biggest reason for living TBH, I can’t think of any other (genuinely what is there to live for?) nothing tops that and I would sacrifice my career over that.
>My point was it's a low level entry point to build a friendship.I guess this could be a good strategy. Since I’m loudly anti-makeup and generally against performative femininity I don’t think I could pretend personally, but yeah I don’t see why not if you can. When I said best friends Are better than casual friends I do mean it - they are the people who really make you feel seen and normal, care about you as a person. But my point is that if you don’t have this then yes, most people are happier if they have some sort of friendship, casual or not.
No. 436961
>>436956Not tryna to be mean but
>I’m so unlike most women>I have 2 best friends and I had others as a teen/kidkek
No. 436964
>>436961I have 2 best friends right now as an adult that I met online at 13, and I had three best friends at separate times a
young child 2-12 years old. I didn’t stop being ostracised by my classmates because I bonded over video games in fandom spaces kek. And as an adult I am even less like normie women because of my views, and I guess also my mental space… It’s not most women, I relate to the average person very little so yes objectively I am unlike them, and all my best friends (sans the ones before 12) are too - that’s the reason why we bonded in the first place.
No. 437058
>>436995go to places where people engage in unusual interests
>drag you down (e.g., drug addiction, self-destructive sexual behavior, unchecked mental illness)this is going to be hard, not everyone is lucky
No. 437063
File: 1728816231895.png (1.95 MB, 864x865, bakery build.png)
Just a vent. I love video games, 2d moids and comfy cozy cottage core aesthetics. But I got so disappointed here in lc sometimes, like when some self described gamedev is working on dating sims, and I want more gameplay than text boxes and dating pngs. Likewise anons always focusing on how moids look like in games and stories. Or when the lolcow minecraft server was 90% pink wood. I thought I had relatively feminine tastes but that was just so samey, I haven't felt the need to log on since. I know technical, action rpg nonnies exist, I've seen them in the /m/ threads but they don't play games I play.
No. 437076
>>437070Monster Hunter World at the moment.
>tfw 60k active players and it's hard to find actual women in game.Also I play building games like Minecraft and Vintage Story but I prefer trying to go for more realistic builds like my earlier picrel, I'm not as good though, kek. My dream is to make an approachable girl rpg game that introduces nonnies to more technical gameplay.
No. 437852
I don't like saying this because it makes me sound like the "not like other girls" types who proclaim how different they are because they watch football or something but I genuinely have nothing in common with most girls and they just do not like me. Unfortunately, in addition to my innate personality I also I fall under
>those of us who spent our formative years on 4chan/other male dominated spaces and got internet poisoning from it
When I was 13 I discovered Encyclopedia Dramatica and 4chan which probably fucked up the trajectory of my life (which was bad in the first place, now made worse). I had already been an outcast my whole life and finding "community" there seemed nice at the time but was obviously a terrible move. My interests and fixations are all very male-aligned as well. Also, women tend to be oversocialised and as someone who holds and espouses a lot of "abnormal" views I have learnt that I could say I was a genocidal white supremacist child molestor who was going to shoot up an elementary school for sexual kicks to a man and he could be fine with it but if I say a word wrong to most women they will crucify me - or rather just disgustedly stop talking to me. Of course I could censor myself but I spent years trying to mask the fact I am a terminal sperg and never found acceptance because it just comes off as uncanny, as well as the fact it is exhausting. I'd rather be alone than pretend to be someone I'm not.
I've learnt adult men will never truly see you as a friend and an equal once they know your gender either. In high school I had zero friends in real life but male friends on the internet to whom I either didn't disclose my gender or outright lied that I was male too, but after many years it's frustrating to have to conceal something that to me is so minor but to them is grounds for ruining our friendship completely. There was one guy I knew for almost a year - we both made WADs for Doom and would share them with each other, played other video games together, exchanged messages frequently with what felt to me like genuine friendship - and I am usually hesitant to say that. One day we were going to play a co-op shooter with voice chat for the first time and literally the second I spoke he started going on about how I was female and how he would never have had the sort of conversations we did if he knew I was a girl. We never had a real conversation again after that. This stands out to me as I had really liked him, but variations of the same thing have happened to me numerous times.
I have been a NEET and a shutin for 2 and a half years now and not only have I not had a single conversation with anyone in real life except my mother in that time, I also don't really even have online friends anymore. It seems like even other girls who claim to be in similar situations to me still think I am too weird.
I never had a particularly strong drive to do any of these things but when I see girls have sleepovers, going to the mall, et cetera, I feel so envious that I will never have those experiences of "sisterhood". I have zero desire to go to the mall and would probably rather drive a railway spike through my skull but it's just the principle of it and what it represents. I have always wanted a real female friend so much even though I know gender differences are mostly socialisation.
Sorry for the wall of text blogpost, I just wanted to get this off my chest and it seemed like the appropriate place to do so.
No. 437874
>>437414You can start any day you want
Psychological warfare is just as good if not more effective than physical. I really don't understand why people get so fixated on the fact women aren't as strong as men. It really doesn't matter with weapons, self defense, psychology. Learn how to embrace cold calculated cruel indifference towards your enemies and you will go far in life.
No. 437884
>>437881I could've written your post. Some things just make me wince and my more 'feminine' friends (idk how to word it) notice it, so i hope i don't come across as judgmental, but i just can't stand seeing it. Acting like a dumb giggling girl around men, pretending to be dumber than they are around men, self-depreciating 'ironically' in really misogynistic ways (like 'he-he i'm just a silly stupid woman! that's what men say! Get it').
>venting about their love lifeYeah. Like you know they would
never end the relationship that makes them suffer or even speak up, you're there to help them privately relieve their overwhelming pain. I don't know how to explain because i'm retarded but sometimes people vent to sort their thoughts and to find support and sometimes it's a way to have someone be a witness to their suffering because they enjoy being the virtuous, weak, sad woman. I'm fine with the first, the second type makes me really uneasy and i don't know how to convey my point without severely offending these women kek
No. 437891
>>437874Women are taught and socialized to have a
victim mentality around men, so it's no wonder. I don't blame them for that if they keep it to themselves, but it's annoying when they constantly have to bring other women down as well. It almost comes off as if they're worshipping men and denigrating women.
>>437877Worrying about men being stronger and harming you is like worrying someone can walk up to you and shoot you in the face one day, or that you can get into a fatal car crash at any time. And even if you were a man, there are always going to be men who are stronger than you. It literally doesn't matter. Of course, be cautious when you can, don't go walking around at bad neighborhoods at 3 am, but the
victim mentality regarding physical strength is so fucking overblown.
No. 437892
>>437891Idk nona men being stronger is just a fact that shapes our day-to-day life. Men act the way they do because they know they can easily overpower women (even relatively strong ones). Acknowledging it doesn't mean you have to obsess over it though, anons who are hung up over this fact should try training and arming themselves if they can, it's better than moping about it online
>don't go walking around at bad neighborhoods at 3 amKek
No. 437900
>>437852I relate to what you wrote a lot nona, from the 4ch past to the (fake) male friends and the fact it feels very hard to feel like you belong even between other "weird" women (like here on lc a lot of the time), I would befriend you
Back to the thread topic, I recently stumbled upon some woman's neocities site, she's from my same country and it made me feel very excited initially, her tastes seemed to be a bit on the weirder side and she seemed to lead a pretty lonely life… I felt like reaching out but then saw she still works and goes to school, mentions having friends repetedly through her posts etc, which is ofc a good thing and I'm happy for her, but I can't say I didn't feel a bit disappointed as she gave me a different impression initially. I feel inadequate/too afraid to ever message now, lmao
No. 437916
>>436570I’m too lazy to quote properly right now but what’s up with that? I’ve always had more success with making male friends because of my hobbies and interests and I’ve heard that thing about ‘You’re one of the guys because you’re autistic’. From like seven different people in these circles, one was a very very unfulfilling relationship but thats a different story.
Why do they do this?
No. 437939
Most of my life I’ve never had trouble befriending women, but now, nearing my 30s, I don’t have the patience to pretend along when they want to talk about men and attraction to them. It’s fine with my close friends, they’d never come to me to thirst on men or something, it’s always deeper than that, but building new friendships has been difficult, specially with those into hobbies that makes them a little obsessed with moids or your common normie women. It’s not like it bothers me or makes me angry at them, it’s just that such conversations are so empty and I don’t have the guts to say “this really doesn’t interest me” because I do like hearing about stuff out of my comfort zone. I just can’t explain if its a complex I need to get over and I don’t know how to approach it.
Texting is fine, I can ignore it, be a little snarky; however, in person, I’m torn between adopting the same persona I’ve always had or establishing some kind of boundary about it. It’s not like I also talk about my sexuality with ssa women, but in the end, it always ends up in me feeling like I need to go through these endless male-dominated subjects to actually connect with them.
No. 437957
>>437950>stalkerDamn, that's scary, glad things are better now. I've pretty much given up on finding true friendship with men at this point yeah. I used to believe they cared about me and share personal details and try to form connection, but every time it just led to the same scenarios of them either confessing, commenting on my height and trying to infantilize me as a weird "flirty" thing, expecting me to laugh at all their gross misogynistic jokes and acting like I'm overly sensitive if I don't, ghosting me for no reason…It's just tiring and ended up feeling like I'm just putting in the effort to talk for absolutely no benefit to myself.
Another thing I hate about the NEET men too is how even when you're also a NEET yourself and "friends" with them, they'll constantly put down your experience and act like they have it worse than you automatically just because you're a woman, I can't count the amount of times moid "friends" I had did this shit and acted like I live life on easy mode because I can get random ugly dudes to fuck me or whatever if I wanted to, as if that solves anything. It feels so demeaning and like they'll never understand what actual loneliness is, I wished I was a moid sometimes since at least it seems like it'd be easier to find other fellow retarded ugly moids and form communities while with women most are less retarded so if you're a weird ugly woman you're kinda fucked. At least that's been my experience, men complain they can't find connections but then have tons of similar copypasted moid friends who regurgitate all their opinions, meanwhile I struggle to find even one woman that's remotely similar to me outside of threads like this
No. 437968
>>437940>>437960i haven't had any as well since entering my teens. except like casual online communities and acquaintances? but not the kind you go out and do stuff with, just classmates i talked to when they felt like it.
personally i guess i didn't really want friends. i kind of hate people. plus the effort and vulnerability involved in becoming close to someone doesn't seem worth it, like the stress of somebody getting to know me and the potential heartbreaks outweigh the positives. so i didn't mind when people started seeing me as the quiet boring chick because they stopped bothering me.
No. 437969
>>436824God same. I wasn't even pretty, maybe I just looked retarded and depressed and they knew I was an easy target. My life with the girls in my school was turbulent and had some drama, but a few guys made my young to late teenage years rough as fuck. Besides pushing me and throwing things at me. They ridiculed me in front of others, even teachers would laugh at their jokes. They hacked my social media account when I was 14, posted that I liked dicks, and spammed porn pictures across my profile. This one guy got overly obsessed with tormenting me and continued stalking me well into my 20s. He even showed up unannounced at my house a few times, and only stopped when I threatened to call the police on him. My female friends adored him. I was constantly having to interact with him because he inserted himself into every friend group I had. I still don't understand what they saw in him, he was ugly and dumb. He looked like a reject Beatles on crack. I kept saying to my friends that I hated him and they somehow didn't understand why, they brushed off what he did as jokes. This certainly taught me to filter out women in my life who actually listened to me, rather than the ones who tag along and expect you to do what they want. Not that I found a lot of women to bond with, but as much as I got hurt by women in my life, in comparison to that, things seemed tame with them.
No. 437981
>>437852>I could say I was a genocidal white supremacist child molestor who was going to shoot up an elementary school for sexual kicks to a man and he could be fine with it but if I say a word wrong to most women they will crucify me - or rather just disgustedly stop talking to meI think this is a large reason I have an easier time talking to men than women, it feels like disagreeing is a bigger taboo among women. It doesn't even have to be anything extreme or controversial (although I have my fair share of unpopular opinions), even minor and trivial disagreements seem to carry more social weight with women. I've heard it be said that male social dynamics have more of a competitive aspect (not necessarily in a combative way, but like including banter and lighthearted jabs) whereas women's social dynamics have a much greater emphasis on harmony and relatability, which I feel like is often accurate.
I also feel pretty bad when I make a woman uncomfortable whereas if a man isn't on the same page as me it's easy to dismiss it and move on.
I relate to the sisterhood stuff too. Truthfully there are a few men that I have had genuinely fulfilling friendships with (although I do think most are horrible) but I never stop wanting the girl bestie kind of friendship that media from my childhood set me up to wish for. I feel like a lot of it is literally just because I have an ingrained belief that I "should" have close female friends because I am female…
No. 438009
I don’t really get this thread because it’s not that difficult to find women that aren’t female-socialised, if not irl then definitely online? Is this an age thing? Is it more common for younger zoomers to just be autistic? Especially since the men I know are definitely much more normie. I would never put up with normie heterosexual woman degeneracy nor would I hang out with moids for being more accepting, they don’t know how to be anything other than superficial hang-out buddies anyway. Like
>>436570, needing both sexes to entirely fulfil your social desires when it’s easier to just find one or two people who cover it all.
>>437874I agree with this as well, and the fact that the people saying this are people that don’t have much of a life irl anyway makes sense to me. It’s much more overblown than reality. And I definitely agree with the anon that said women’s biggest weakness is having a
victim mentality.
No. 438041
I'm kinda desperate for some female friends but it feels impossible to meet people when you're over 25 and in a new state and have niche interests. I have a few female coworkers but I just always know they already have friends and I'm just a coworker so I shouldn't get my hopes up. Nobody wants to invite you to anything when you don't know any references and your voice is so high pitched people think you're faking it.
>>437076I got a new job and my lead and her friend both had switches so I asked if they played Monster Hunter Rise and one deadass asked me "what do you do in that game?" It was so hard to not plainly say "hunt monsters". At least they played Zelda.
No. 438446
>>438428nonny i was in the same situation and sure, it'll be hard but probably not as horrible as you imagine, i bet there'll be a few slightly older students too. not everyone figures their life out at 18. when i was doing a foundation course we had a literal old lady there and we all loved her.
if you're curious how i'm doing: i still fucking hate going outside and being around people so no, i've not found any college besties, and yes, i resent scrolling through the retarded zoomer groupchat for info about assignments. personally i'm not trying to make any friends but i still had fun when i got assigned a group project with some other older students. just do the work and be civil anon, you'll be fine.
No. 438671
For me one thing that really alienates me from others is whenever or not someone received the "princess treatment" all their lives. I'm talking about people like Jillian who were spoiled, sheltered, treated like the most special person in the world, defended to death from any criticism, and never had any consequences for their actions or a moment of self reflection. This is not exclusive of women, a whole lot of men are like this too, maybe way more than women actually. Worst case scenario they become super narcissistic, judgemental, and quick to anger, but there's plenty of cases in which it's obvious that particular person wants to be the center of attention and affection, so anything you do has to be in service of them, since they have main character syndrome. You see it a lot on social media.
I'm also alienated from anyone who uses woke language when defending themselves, I know this is a dime a dozen online and of course it occurs both sexes but the only time I've encountered it irl was from another woman, which weirded me out because I'm used to spaces like lolcow where most women are of course not like that. She was quick to anger and defended woke things on her facebook, I disagreed with her once on something, she got mad, and when I tried to apologize and explain myself to her she said I was gaslighting her, and I was not. It still makes me upset to this day because I really liked her as a friend, we had things in common not related to wokeism and it's hard to make good long lasting friendships after a certain age. I wonder if I should contact her and try to apologize again, I don't know nonnies.
No. 438717
>>438671I've moved away from using "woke" since far righters co-opted it to mean anything vaguely liberal, but it really is a mindset I find unfortunately common among women. I've felt more on edge about mentioning anything vaguely political around women aged 18-40 5x more than men, since in my experience they enforce and have bigger social consequences for it. Or they ruin friendships with that therapyspeak about friendship 101 being "emotional labor" or whatever.
>>438713Who cares?
No. 438777
File: 1729381281547.png (642.76 KB, 1022x731, my average experience.png)
I just hate this social anxiety who fucks with my brain every time.
Cant do irl friendships because some scrote falls with me even doing the low effort or trying so hard to make female friends just to get screwed up or completely ignored when they are done with me.
I have an history behind me with bullying in a girls-only high school and having a shitty family. Doing therapy with meds, but still feel like a fucking alien.
Why is so hard to socialize now? In my case, is always about making "weird faces" or "talking too much" when I have to interact with other girls. "Well, I cant have a mirror in my pocket everytime to check my expressions, and sorry if I talked too much about X, I was really happy" and even with that, they just stick to leave me behind the conversation.
Maybe is my loneliness who makes me more retarded than already am (plus having fucking anime and movies to teach me about frens and rabu), but would like knowing other worlds and sharing my experiences and ideas. I hate being fake but often I think that cant go full mode with being myself, I feel judged every single second.
No. 438788
>>438432I’ve considered it. If I’m autistic I’m not sure where to go from here. Autism has become a trendy diagnosis, so if I bring it up I’m sure the doctor will think I’m a tiktard. I’ve checked out autistic spaces online, and though I relate to some aspects, I don’t think I’d fit in there either. Fml.
>>438446Thanks! I’m glad your college experience is going well despite having no besties.
>>438683Yeah, it just sucks. I’d much rather have friends or at least a girlfriend than dive deep into my hobbies or career. You're right though, if something is innately wrong, I can’t fix it, so there's no point in dwelling on what I can’t get. I hope so too.
>>438738I’m nice to know I’m not alone in how I feel. I wish that too.
No. 438853
>>438733Stop being so easily
triggered, wtf about that post was "narc"
No. 438857
>>438788It's true that it's trendy, but if you're obviously autistic and clearly have a history, as well as have family or someone else whose known you a long time back it up you shouldn't have a problem. But if you don't want or see a point in a diagnosis that's okay too. A diagnosis test will be extensive and you may learn other things about yourself. Embrace autism is a good resource, they have some tests here.
https://embrace-autism.com/autism-tests/I also don't relate to many autists, I'm not that kind of autistic I guess! I rarely make online friends unlike other autistic people it seems. The "autistic community" isn't fully representative women like us, it's a minority of autistic people.
No. 439556
File: 1729629288362.png (1.51 MB, 1280x914, 1714688115934.png)
I wish I was a normie so bad. Unlike most nonnas itt I'm not an autist and I'm actually quite extroverted irl and it's hard for me to pin what exactly I'm doing wrong… I've never had a best friend, not even as a child and I was a very open and friendly kid. I would always approach other children to play together. It's like the subconsciously knew there was something off even then.
I know some anons might say I'm complaining for nothing but I hate the fact that no matter how well I get along with another woman I'm just never friendship material to her. I'm like that one acquaintance everyone says is cool and talks to from time to time but is never allowed to actually move to the next level of the relationship. They will talk to me once a year or if they happen to pass me on the street. And I tried different ways to approach it, I tried being a trendy normie, I tried to get along with nerdy girls, I tried it with artsy pretentious women. I know a little bit of everything so I can always find something to talk about. The only thing I stay quiet on is make up because I don't wear it and I'm opposed to it, just don't voice this opinion to anyone. I refuse to believe this all goes down to me not being feminine enough but I can't help but think have I been born male I would be normal, maybe even popular. Even as a child I felt like I was doing something wrong. Sure, I played with dolls and princess dresses but my personality was often deemed too boyish by adults in my life. I remembered being punished for playing around with boys in the dirt as a child and being called a tomboy for it like it was a slur.
I don't even think that I'm masculine at all. I even enjoy a few stereotypical things like talking about what attractive scrotes but having any sort of standards as a woman brands you a psychopath so I never do. I genuinely don't get what I'm doing wrong, it makes me want to cry how lonely I feel.
No. 439609
>>439604You were a child. You don't have to hate yourself for it, you're allowed to forgive yourself. I imagine most girls go through a women hating phase, or a "I'm not like other girls" phase before we realise how silly and stupid it is. I know I definitely thought I was so different when I was younger (not better mind you, just different, as I've always struggled to fit in and even to this day I have more close male friends) and now I'm older I realise I'm just like all the other girls because all girls are unique in their own way. I'm convinced that as we're raised we're told that so many of our traits are faults and weaknesses so it's no wonder we would want to distance ourselves from that.
I don't think getting on better with men immediately makes it a pick me behaviour. As long as you don't put down other women and don't think you're inherently better than them, there's no issue. It's only
problematic if you actively avoid being friends with other women because they are women, but you yourself mentioned you do have female friends you can be yourself around. So just relax.
No. 439814
File: 1729703292429.jpg (117.12 KB, 736x919, cd319945ffd25048fd4c98f96d198a…)
I recently started putting more effort into my appearance, in the hopes of looking less sloppy, but I feel like every piece of advice I find is for girly girls. The women explaining hair care and fashion on youtube are so annoying, braindead, and superficial (the worst part is when they make poses for the camera with a self-satisfied smirk) but there just doesn't seem to be anything else.
I've tried to look into dark academia cause it seems at least a bit more fitting, but even there… how the hell do I do any of these looks without make up, jewelry, skirts etc…? I feel like there's no way for me to look put together without dressing at least a bit more feminine. No one expects make up from a guy but they do with women. So I'll always look sloppy next to women that wear it. A guy only needs to wear dress pants and a shirt but if I do that I'll look like I put in no effort. I wish there was some normal, masculine but well-dressed woman who could explain this to me.
How do you guys deal with this?
No. 439834
>>439818Do you accessorize?
Also, is there any type of clothing in particular you would recommend? I've been wearing jeans and t-shirts until now. Dress pants? Blouses? Or is that overkill?
No. 439839
>>439834>accessories?Sometimes. I usually always wear a bracelet or ring, but nothing crazy. When I go out to the mall or on a date, I'll wear earrings and maybe a necklace. Depends. Do belts count as accessories? I wear perfume as well.
Jeans and t-shirts could be fashionable if you get jeans that fit you really perfectly, especially if they're an unusual color. Do you know your color season or have an idea of what colors look good on you? Dark brown or mustard color jeans like your picrel could look nice while not being too much. T-shirts can be cute if they have a fun or interesting graphic on them. Plus you can layer with a jacket or long sleeved shirt under, or a necklace on top. Dress pants and blouses aren't too formal imo, but if you want to get into wearing suits, that's what I'd call too much.
No. 439846
>>439814i'm like 99% certain that i dress shittier than you so don't listen to me, but i do it with intention tbh.
1. watch content targeted both towards women and men to keep in mind the insane amount of effort required from women 2. find a couple of creators whose style you find inspiring. you don't need a lot (because you won't find a lot) 3. try stuff on, understand your body, shape and preferences, it's a long process 4. confidence.
No. 439848
File: 1729705616813.jpg (3.35 MB, 2880x2880, butch.jpg)
>>439814I'm not sure if you're a lesbian, but typing "casual butch style" into Google yielded these. Maybe this could help, they look causal but also very clean and put-together.
and hot No. 439905
>>439839Yeah, I have read up on the color stuff. I'm into painting, so color coordination is fortunately not that hard for me. I'm a soft summer and I decided to wear desaturated blue, cream, brown and sage green for the most part.
Thanks for the tip on the colored jeans, that sounds interesting. I only have one pair that isn't blue or black right now but I'll experiment a bit more in that direction.
I'm worried I'll look too much like a teenager if I wear graphic tees. People already tell me that I look like a teen often, it was one of the
trigger for me deciding to get better at fashion
No. 439932
here's this
in this current climate of bs feminism, women are expected to either be victims or girlbosses who managed to rise above
I'm clearly neither
in the sense that I don't feel the need to be victimized in usual sense nor does my existence feel successful in any way
my perception of womanhood is kind of tainted this way
on one hand, I realize women have to deal with way more bs that men do, and I doubt I need to expand and that part
in turn, that makes the expectation of a woman to fold into those last two archetypes
on the other hand, I'll put it plainly, I feel privileged
I was born an entitled brat and I'll likely die one, considering the state of my life hasn't evolved much since teenagehood
in that sense, I feel much closer to the whims of pretentious moids who feel like they're owed the world rather than had to deal with the plight of pseudo victimhood ingrained into their personality to the point they stop whining about it
and I say this as much as I find this kind of incelish behavior despicable, I hate myself in the same way
I feel like every time I see a woman I expect them to be much more mature than I am in that sense, but then again that might be biased by my severely biased terminally online kind of socialization
I guess it makes me feel inadequate but I still realize this just stems from frustration with my rather depressive and shallow mean of subsistence rather than any sort of jealousy
I doubt I'm making my message come across anyway, and I don't even know if this is right thread for this, but I had to spell it out
I don't think I'll ever have a woman as a friend
or any at all
thankfully for them
No. 439938
>>439934I can't even tell what you mean at this point
but thanks anyway
No. 440246
>>440079well then, sorry for assuming that was the point of this thread
pretty much demonstrates how, I'm fairly convinced only 4chan-adjacent, neet-types are ever going to relate to this
turns out, you can't be both a loser and a woman
manchild might be asked to man up, but that's only because they're expected to be left behind
but as it stands, there's no "moral equivalency", as they like to say
No. 440296
>>440265online socialization is the last refuge for those who have willfully shunned themselves away from having to relate with their immediate social environment, so at least that's a prerequisite
ever heard of this quote?
"Distrust those cosmopolitans who search far in their books for duties that they neglect to fulfil towards those around them. Such philosophers love the Tartars to so as to be spared from loving their neighbours."
>>440284sorry, I know I'm quite awkward at spelling this out, but what I'm trying to say is, I don't feel like I belong anywhere, not here, not on 4chan, I just seethe on my own, since I won't ever be allowed to get away with as much nonsense as men do
here's an irrelevant personal anecdote, when I was still in college, you'd often get student coming in late to the study sessions, and 100% of the time, it'd be men, and well aware of this, our lecturer would make a joke about it, insisting on us noticing that, as a woman, you're not expected to fail, you're expected to have been born a try-hard, for the simple reason you've been dealt with shit your whole life
well I haven't, I'm lazy, I dropped out, and now I might as well be invisible, since I won't even get acknowledged out of spite
No. 440825
File: 1729951998897.jpg (23.53 KB, 293x300, cowboy be bop.jpg)
>>439556I can relate to you nona. Sometimes you have to play like a masquerade to make acquaintances and friends, but I think is better to stay alone (even if you can barely hold on) rather than being "fake" at the eyes of those women who I think are inside of circlejerks. Think about that as a sort of russian roulette where when the bullet hits in 5/6 opportunities for bad, and like
>>439560 said, is just luck at this point. Kudos to you, Reki fan, you sound like a good person.
>>439604Being honest, I was aware of 4chan since I was little, but just lurked it time to time. English is my second language so I didnt have the feel to actually participate. Helped me to find out media I enjoy, but at the same time fucked up my brain. Like, sometimes I find out myself thinking/typing like one of those scrotes… very unsettling. Even when 4chan is treated like le obscure site full of hackers (and Reddit/Twitter being kinda the norm) I think the chan culture is still the same everywhere. Like other anons said, you arent alone in this. In my own experience, knowing that you have those thoughts and even behaviors, you can always change for the better. Its not easy, but is always the way to break free from the internet poisoning.
No. 440881
>>440857>She was eating alone and practically scowling at everyone walking byYou probably just saw me
>>440878The latter
No. 440973
>>422882>>422732NTA from any part of this discussion, this is incredibly late but I had some screed in my head about having trouble relating to women since I run into a lot that end up doing this (talking mad shit to the point nobody feels safe). I'm generally in that position where I hear a ton of shit-talking and assume I'm not immune to it if I piss off the wrong person too. Feels a bit vindicating to hear it since I always thought I was the asshole for leaving.
I wish I could say exactly those posts to some female friends I recently had to cut off in a way they would understand - the negativity is so draining. I'm willing to say it's just bad luck and mental issues/shit home life making me not really see red flags early enough, but it seems like so many women just enjoy sitting in groups and torching everyone they know. I understand feeling comfortable enough to gossip about things, but I do not understand talking trash on people, and then wasting their time by still inviting them to parties and acting like nothing was said.
I don't fucking get it. By the time I'm talking shit on someone, it's because I'm fine with never seeing them again and the bridge is burned for whatever reason. I hate hearing "don't take it personally" since in situations like what you're referring to, the shit-talk is entirely personal.
No. 441002
>>440999Me too, I have a low libido in the first place so masturbating is enough for me as well, and to me the cons outweigh the pros when it comes to sex (don't want to be vulnerable,
don't want to risk pregnancy/STI, don't want to veto a bunch of people until I find the right one…), it helps that I don't want to settle down or have children. I don't get why so many anons get so pressed about some women not being interested in sex, they act weirdly superior and smug about fucking their nigels as if we would be jealous of that. Weirdly enough normie women are more accepting of that fact, I've let it slip to some of my coworkers that I was still a virgin at my age and it wasn't a big deal to them.
No. 441794
I recently figured out my kibbe type, cut my hair short and thrifted a new wardrobe. Finally I'm sometimes being treated like a peer by other women, but it does give me whiplash every time. I'm so not used to it, that it doesn't immediately register that they're actually talking to me and not someone behind me or something kek. I'm not sure even whether I'm happy about it, because it feels so superficial. I'm still the same autist and I was already clean and tidy before, so I don't agree with
>>439818 that it's 70% of looking fashionable. At least not for everyone. I would be happy to be make more friends, because I desperately need them, but it feels like a weird barrier of entry and shallow to have to look fashionable in order to make friends.
No. 441951
>>427046SAME. This is my mother, except she
does explode on a regular basis about how put-upon she is and how she does everything for everyone except for herself. Part of me feels really bad for her, because it's like she can't function any other way. But at the same time she does shit like actively choosing not to sit down, or eat, or rest, and then explodes in rage-crying that "she never got to sit/eat/rest, and NOBODY cares!!" It just feels like martyrdom at this point, she wants people to fawn and tell her to relax, just so that she can say "NooOoo, I can't! I don't have time!"
>>427035>They always take their suffering as a point of pride and say it's a mark of womanhood, what a fucking cope. Of course since it's a mark of womanhood if you aren't serving as a doormat you're either "childish" or very "male-like".THIS THIS SO MUCH THIS. I was constantly told by my parents that I was "more like a boy" instead of a girl, and that I'm selfish and "not naturally a nurturing person" because I don't immediately drop everything to serve others. If that makes me moidlike, then so be it, I guess. I'd rather be that than a weeping doormat.
No. 441994
>>427035>and women/radfem also fall for that shit and take it as a point of pride being "empathetic" and "kinder" than moidsIt's not even genuine empathy a lot of the time. It's compliance with masochism. I think some femininity is good and genuine empathy is part of that, but the whole 'look at me i'm so nice and i suffer so much, please acknowledge how good i am' thing pisses me off. Women who adhere too hard to this are full of resentment because it doesn't come from sincere concern for others, it's basically a self-made prison. It's fucking bleak and once you see it you can't unsee it. The other day i was listening to a woman angrily ranting about someone she knows because he went no-contact with his PoS alcoholic violent dad instead of being
understanding and
nice, i couldn't contain my irritation and told her i get the guy. It always comes down to either getting off (figuratively) to being the most pitiful woman or having so little boundaries they can't distance themselves from anyone, harming themselves and others in the process. I really don't see what's good, moral or empathetic about this. I'm not sure they're getting a lot out of being like this either, it's such a shitty tradeoff
>if you aren't a doormat you're 'childish'Men get to be selfish adults in peace. Adulthood is responsibility, but somehow it has to come with masochism for it to count in women
No. 442952
File: 1730837741804.png (513.65 KB, 785x533, 1640321650072.png)
What's a (seemingly) unintentionally insulting comment another woman has made about you?
For me, it was finding out I had been described as being very 'male brained' by my peers in an attempt to justify to others why I had a really bad habit of 'mansplaining' things to people.
I'm a lot more mindful as to not do it now, but basically I'd reiterate what someone else had said prior or I would info dump about a given topic unprompted to the request of no one. Up until that point, I had no clue that was even something I was doing, let alone that it bothered people, and I suspect the reason I never noticed was because I was almost entirely friends with men beforehand.
I didn't realize how badly that comment hurt me at the time until I brought up the experience to someone else and unexpectedly started crying halfway through describing it. I know their intentions were in the right place, but hearing those exact phrases made me feel like I wasn't 'female' enough for other women.
No. 442963
>>442952Man, that really sucks especially since you weren't doing it on purpose.
I used to love when people would say that I have a calming/relaxing aura but now I hate hearing it especially from people that don't know me that well because that just means I'm a doormat that they see as easy to use and get upset when I match their energy.
No. 442988
>>442952Being constantly told I look like a deer in the headlights/frightened rabbit when I'm in a normal situation. If the women who say this stuff was a bit older and nice, I might feel comforted (and a bit faint kek) but it's been from women my own age who are more socially confident and conventionally successful than me. Makes me feel like a child and a
victim and reminds me of the times people have hurt and taken advantage of me all the time, and then I start thinking I'm never going to stop attracting creeps and abusers. Fun!
No. 443359
File: 1731031568274.png (669.18 KB, 718x756, sigh.png)
>Anon, do you have (insert social media)?
No, the answer is always no. I hate dwelling on how I am perceived in general, and social media provokes an endless loop of the worst thoughts and feelings in me. I admit I have paranoid tendencies, but even aside from any persecutory lines of thinking, I think most would agree that social media is too pervasive and revealing. Yet everyone still uses it, and you seem like a weirdo for not letting strangers peer into your life! And I feel especially isolated from women when most of them are conditioned to garner attention for their appearance and to compete with one another over it. Sometimes I have intrusive thoughts comparing myself to women I see when I am out in public, even though I have yet to invest any effort or concern in having men in my life so far I'm a khhv. And when I occasionally feel curious enough to check what the girl's I used to know are posting, it reminds me to feel even more vindicated in how reserved I am. There's this one girl that has her bikini pictures from high school reposted on a huge account with tons of likes, and she's tagged in it. Imagine who is liking it and commenting on it. If this happened to me I would be mortified, yet she still posts the same kinds of pictures and welcomes the attention. They weren't exactly overly risque by most "normal" people's standards, but I feel like such a freakish prude when I try to explain to other women why this bothers me. I usually don't think about this since I usually don't interact with people, but sometimes I do want to connect a bit more with the women around me. Then I hesitate as I go over this topic in my head again.
No. 443363
>>443359Same.
I firmly believe that not having any public social media (and even more so, not having irl pictures of you/your face up online) protects you from bad actors of all kinds, be it predatory moids, shady government services, AI data scraping from all sides, etc. Problem is, I go to public gatherings and refusing to get my pictures taken (when literally everyone else is rather enthusiastic about getting themselves photographed) gets me weird looks or unwanted attention.
No. 443405
File: 1731062908833.jpeg (222.16 KB, 952x1003, 1715645859486.jpeg)
>>443359>>443363You guys get it. I am absolutely opposed to social media of all kind and never post my pictures online and it really fucks with my social life. People might like me irl but when they ask to exchange social media it's like I'm a creep suddenly. I've had people tell me that minimal digital footprint means I have something to hide (one moid even "joked" that I must be into some kinky stuff, fucking barf).
Even worse, the field I'm in sort of requires me to have a social media presence if I want to have any opportunities because it's all about networking nowadays.
I hate it but I think I'm going to break and make a private account, just never post my face there.
I'm going to be honest here, but I think the fact that I didn't have any social media as a teenager in the 2010s cost me a lot of my social life.
No. 443410
>>443405I would immediately befriend you. I like people who avoid social media and posting their pictures online because its very dangerous to do that sort of thing. They used to teach us about privacy and Internet safety back in the day but nowadays everyone has social media with their full names and faces, it's ridiculous. I have only 2 friends
the only reason I have them is because our parents are friends and I met them in childhood kek and I love them but one of them is obsessed with social media, and this weird app called BeReal and is always trying to take pictures of us together to post online. I refuse her everytime and she gets mad at me and I tell her "next time" to placate her but I think she's really mad I'm not the "ideal fun" friend and the boring prude friend instead. She says there won't be any proof of our friendship but why do we need to show the world proof. We know we're friends. I don't get it.
No. 443761
File: 1731224596232.jpeg (154.96 KB, 1052x681, IMG_4759.jpeg)
I hate it when they post shit like this
No. 443775
File: 1731230736442.jpg (50.95 KB, 736x736, IMG_9301.JPG)
every day i’m tricking people into thinking i’m likeable. i’m no longer the creepy outsider girl, just a normal slightly standoffish woman. it lets me get away with being a loser more easily but while people may not go out of their way to talk to me, they don’t really avoid me either. sometimes i wish they did. i feel such a pervasive sense of wrongness around them. being treated normally just casts into light how abnormal i am under the surface.
i’m the problem and i’ll always be the problem. i don’t know why but my brain filters out every emotion except anger and irritation, i have to kinda fake everything else. i’m so scared of people, specifically of someone managing to make me feel a fraction of what a normal human would feel when making meaningful connections, and to then lose it. if i see them as enemies it makes them less scary.
No. 443783
>>443762Some, but the majority don’t. This is a
toxic woman thing, not exactly normal. (Source: I have an aunt who laughed at me for choosing ‘masculine’ socks at the store. She’s pretty dysfunctional but it still confused me kek)
No. 443874
>>443823>but I doubt the thinking is as explicit and straightforward as that anon suggests. Sure, it may be not as straightforward in these women's heads, but it still leads to the same thing - ostracization of women percieved as not fulfilling their social "female" gender role by being GNC in any percievable way.
>>443779>>443780Have you ever been bullied for "not being female enough"? This is exactly it and this is what the whole fucking thread is about. Are we all sissies?
No. 444756
>>443761God this is so dumb.
>Women will only want to be friends with you if you perform femininity!I want this to be a tranny because if this is what women really think I'm doomed.
No. 444762
>>444756It's dumb. Outwardly feminine women can be really chill for all kinds of reasons, or if they notice you aren't into girly things and want to be on your level. A lot of the time it's just a script, they'll comment on each others appearance in an affected high-pitched voice as a ritual (irritating but regardless) then they move on to other topics. And there are enough women who simply don't care at all about kawiwi aesthetics and would rather bond over other shared interests. This reads like someone who only experienced surface level socializing with girls and tries to guess what female friendships are like from a distance.
>here's how to befriend girls>girls like pink>no like pink? Nlog, nlog is bad>say you like pink and girls will befriend youKek if this was the case you wouldn't see women into kawiwi alt fashion struggle with socializing. Girls bully atypical women for things that go way beyond superficial markers like a cutesy sense of fashion, it's actually about your empathy, how good you are at making them comfortable, how good you are at catching implicit cues and caring about them. A woman complimenting another on her eyeliner means nothing at all
No. 444827
>>444790I don’t think empathy matters when women in a lot of environments (ie offices, high school) are exclusionary and cliquey. Not all of them - there are kind women everywhere - but in my experience being kind and empathetic all the time tends to make you a target, get you called ‘naive’ and childlike etc.That said I’ve been in some pretty
toxic workplaces so it could just be me.
No. 445283
>>444824Same, and the worst part is that the curves don't even go away unless I starve myself down to bmi 15.
>inb4 lazy anachans would rather starve their brains off than hit the gymHitting the gym doesn't reshape your bone structure.