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No. 445663
Discuss goth music, makeup, fashion that you love. People you admire, gossip, news, etc.
previous thread:
>>86956 No. 445669
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I’d give anything to go back and live in the late 90s/early 2000s. Felt like the perfect time to be a goth. I cant stop watching and reading goth stuff from that time period. It’s too late for me now but that nostalgia….
No. 445686
>>445672Is there water in the ocean?
Are boar shitting and pissing in the forest?
No. 445701
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>>445612>But overall my sentiments align with >>445483 where I think a lot of the stuff look too tacky and costumey for me to fele to ever wear them which is funny because as someone who likes the romantic look, I've fallen for the trap of trying some of their pieces that look romantic only to not feel confident or comfortable in it at allThat's why I can't shop online. The reason I bought the Romwe top is because I could see and feel it. It hits the Romantic vibes and I think if I saw it on the internet, I wouldn't buy it. It's too much of a gamble for me, and I don't like to waste money. I'd be crushed if I bought something that looked romantic and find out the fabric was cheap or it didn't look right. The advice I can give anons who were scammed like that; get an unpicker and buy some material that you like. Unpick the shirt or whatever, and lay that garment over your chosen fabric. Cut out around the pieces and sew a new one. That might seem like a lot of effort, but if the style is right but the material is wrong, it's worth it. Trads did that in the 80s and 90s and I appreciate their dedication. I know it's easier to buy a few things from Shein or Killstar, but I feel like they enjoy scamming us.
No. 445707
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>>445669I think we tend to romanticise these eras. If you got picked on or harassed for being goth, it wasn't fun. Yes, the clothes were cool but they were expensive. I didn't like Christians chasing me down the street with a Bible to repent and come to God. There were better things like people didn't spend all their time looking at their phones. We actually hung out with friends. The music was ok but bands like Slipknot and Korn were lumped in with goth. You were still the outcast even among alt kids because goth was seen as the extreme end of the spectrum. Goths usually stuck together and it was a relief to see other goths in places because you knew you had something in common.
No. 445856
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>>445616>My favorite ever skirt came from a renaissance festival stall.I've bought some cool jewellery from Ren faires. Some do leather belts or leather under bust corsets. We can make ourselves unique without looking like Killstar clones.
No. 445870
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Anyone bought anything from
https://www.rocknromancevintage.com/ ? Basically a lot of 1950s style designs. They look nice in the photos. No idea how items look in person and what is quality. Picrel is a random image of black stuff from their offer.
No. 445941
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>>445669I'm honestly split tbh. On the one hand, while I wasn't a goth in the late 90s-early 2000s as I was just a "mallgoth" lol If I were an actual goth back then, I feel I would've liked it if I knew the right people and was able to go see goth bands performing. But on the other hand, finding goth music was quite difficult compared to the turn of music social media like bandcamp and music archive sites. And not to mention all the misappropriation that goth had with so many non-goth bands being referred to as "goth". I started to learn better about goth around 2008 and I then understood why older goths were annoyed of mallgoth.
>>445707I think you're right that maybe we do romanticize the earlier eras but it's tough not to if you lived through it, the more significant thing about the 90s and early-mid 00s was that it was final decades before the world got swept by social media. It existed, we had LiveJournal and MySpace but they were more like passing things and not used in a way like how TikTok is used. And of course we can still kinda live like those times, well try to anyway by hanging out with our friends in person if life hasn't gotten too busy. Unfortunately for many of us, life did get busy and we lost touch of friends and it can tough trying to make time to meet new people if your own life is busy plus the rising cost of things like gas and all that, it's kinda depressing lol.
And even though we did get picked on and bullied, I really did like that sense of camaraderie that alt kids had. School life could be tough but if you had that small but tight group, it made things so much more bearable and fun.
>>445714>Nowadays most people who dress alternative are boring vapid egirls or pandering to 'big titty goth girl' fetishistsI so feel this. I used to work at a grocery store and I remember a few times whenever I would see someone who looked alt, I would compliment and try to have a brief conversation about music. I still remember one of them who looked like a goth exclaim she didn't know who Sisters of Mercy or Rosetta Stone were but she really liked Ghost and was a Swifty… Not that it's wrong to like non-alt music or anything but it's rare when I find other people who are into goth rock or even alt rock these days. I know they are out there but they seem to rarer to find as each year passes. I think it's partly because rock music in general is not really popular anymore which makes me feel even older and I'm only in my early 30s lol.
No. 446044
>>445856A local renaissance faire in my state has a "thrift shop" booth. It carries pre-owned clothes from actual renn faire shops and brands, but also a bunch of normal clothes that can be worked into garb. Peasant tops, flowy skirts, corset style tops, accessories. I try to buy some stuff while I'm there. I also trawl thrift stores near me.
I have a pinterest board with some goth or alt looks that I like, so I often try to look for pieces that are close to those inspiration pics to help guide me. I work in an office-y job so corporate goth or "cardigan goth" (not a real thing, I know) are phrases I also keep in mind for more wearable but dark stuff.
No. 446398
>>446387I was actually watching a history video on makeup and I had to internally laugh when it got to Kat Von D and I kid you not but the person said she was the one who pioneered and popularized "goth makeup". Mind you this person didn't even talk about goth musicians like Siouxsie, Robert Smith, Patricia Morrison, and/or Monica Richard who were known for some of their makeup looks and actually are a part of the goth scene, well Patricia and Monica anyway since Siouxsie moved on.
Anyway I say this because your comment on how dark makeup is so accesible made me think of that video and what it said about Kat Von D's makeup brand and how back in the day you hd lots of people raving how goth they were for wearing her products when actual goths couldn't care less about it but to the masses, buying Kat Von D brand is like so goff.
No. 446926
>>446908It was an okay song but I wouldn't personally tink of it as a goth song but it is some groovy dark synthwave. Shame though because some goth style guitars would've really sounded nice with that song and the band clearly knows of that style of guitar as they used it in this song (vidrel).
But as is, some fun synthwave and I can see it being a hit on the dancefloor.
No. 446936
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>>446932Are you like the whole one nona in this threads that has problem with drag makeup despite it being widespread in punk?
No. 446938
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No. 446964
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As a non goth I wanted to share my goth experience. My friend at the time a few years ago took me to a goth concert. It was a bunch of bands playing the strangest sounding music to my kpop loving ass and people dancing in the oddest way. At first i was so uncomfortable because it was so dark and the dude sounded like he was crying on stage. But quickly I started having fun. I had the BEST time of my life. I felt so free. I didn’t worry about dancing weird because we all were. I felt like I developed abs becauseI was laughing and dancing so much. I never felt so happy to be alive. By the end of the concert a girl came up to me and even called me pretty. I complimented her too. I was shocked because I’m pretty sure I was dressed like a normie’s version of a goth. It was so nice. I’ve always wanted to go back but I don’t have friends anymore smh. But I swear it was the best time I ever had in my life. I just want to thank you Goths for making me feel welcomed that night. I wanted all of your shoes.
No. 447172
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Has anyone else heard about this or other labels pulling a stunt like this? Any label recs that have stated they won't be using AI. It just seems so antithetical to the spirit of goth. For a scene that is so diy and started from the punk movement, it's gross.
No. 447263
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I'm trying to find a shoe for everyday that still fits my look. But after looking at so many options I'm undecided which one of those look best. Any ideas?
also nico was kind of proto goth
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87jYbzHPZOM No. 448004
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>>445498>It feels like a lot more mainstream clothes could be remixed into something goth back in the '90s and '00s. I remember being able to pick up romantic tops with dramatic sleeves like what you've posted, Victorian-looking jewelry, quality velvet and lace, flowing skirts, and interesting boots at department stores.This. I remember some shops like Target, K-Mart, or even Kohl's selling romantic tops. It wasn't marketed to us, but you could totally make it work in a goth wardrobe. If if was cotton I would dye them burgundy or black. I had a top like picrel that was black and it went with everything. Long dusters were easy to come by and cotton maxi dresses or skirts looked very romantic year round. I remember some shops selling pointed toe boots for autumn. I really miss those days.
No. 448089
>>448086Heck, even bell crop tops are available there
https://www.walmart.com/search?q=bell+crop+topAre you nonas even trying?
No. 448273
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>>448164I think this would be the reason for Zoomers reviving the 90s with 'whimsy goth'. When the runways started doing goth or witch themes, every store tried to copy it. More than likely this is the reason the 1990s-2000s carried that sort of style.
No. 448330
>>448290I think that it's kinda cool seeing how these people make those hairstyles out of wigs, it's quite creative and at this point in time I can understand if someone doesn't want to fry their hair. But I also understand how it can give a part-timer to even poser vibe. Like the person only made the wig to film their TikTok video, then plop it off and put it in their closet not wearing it again until they film their next TikTok video or Instagram photo.
That being said, my sentiment mirrors
>>448314 where so long as they genuinely like the music and it's not some costume used to get "cool" points for attention on their social media, it's all good.
No. 448472
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No. 448473
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No. 448474
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No. 448573
>>448346>My dad would not let me dye my hair black. He thought it was too extreme.Kek man this kinda takes me back though for me, it was my mom who wouldn't let me dye my hair black, my dad was indifferent but my mom got final say and it wasn't until I was about 16 where she finally let me. It's just funny how back in the late 90s and 00s, dying your hair black was considered "extreme", I wonder if it's still like that now?
That said, I can understand why one would think that someone who only wears a black wig but keeps their hair a natural blonde color could read as a poser in the term of a "part-timer" but personally, I try not to judge on that stuff so long as the person actually listens to and likes the music.
No. 448721
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No. 448818
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>>448573>It's just funny how back in the late 90s and 00s, dying your hair black was considered "extreme", I wonder if it's still like that now?As far as teenagers go, I'm not sure. I see some with dyed hair but most seem pretty average. The ones who are alt or goth bordering have purple or blue hair. I haven't seen many with black hair, which is interesting.
>but keeps their hair a natural blonde color could read as a poser in the term of a "part-timer"I had some strong views about what goth is when I was a teen. It had to be black or nothing. But I eventually relaxed on those ideas. I could wear a purple skirt if I wanted to. Goths could have brown or blonde hair if they wanted(but I still think black looks better). They could look like one of the Cretins from Class Of Nuke'em High so long as they listen to the music. Because like we've all said, goth is a music based subculture.
No. 449108
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>As far as teenagers go, I'm not sure. I see some with dyed hair but most seem pretty average. The ones who are alt or goth bordering have purple or blue hair. I haven't seen many with black hair, which is interesting.
AYRT and yeah, I see a lot more alt looking youths with unnatural colors, mainly purple and blue as well, it's honestly kinda boring (but expected) to see.
>I had some strong views about what goth is when I was a teen. It had to be black or nothing. But I eventually relaxed on those ideas.
>Goths could have brown or blonde hair if they wanted(but I still think black looks better)
I can totally understand, I too think that black hair looks the best though I also think that blonde could look nice with the look as well but I think it's because I had a big crush on Sean Brennan from London After Midnight and he used to sport blodne hair before he eventually dyed his hair red and stuck with that color for the longest and no hate to his style but I felt the blonde looked a lot better kek He seems to have dyed his hair black in recent years and I think it looks quite nice on him as well. But yeah seeing wild blonde hair contrast with black velvet outfits with the usual goth style jewelry, I think it can look quite pretty.
But yeah, just enjoy the music and don't worry about your hair color.
No. 449227
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>>449108>AYRT and yeah, I see a lot more alt looking youths with unnatural colors, mainly purple and blue as well, it's honestly kinda boring (but expected) to see.I wonder if Trads saw us like that, because in the 2000s most of us had red hair. I used to dye mine with Manic Panic Pillarbox Red. Then later on I used Vampire Red because the burgundy went with my Romantic style.
>I can totally understand, I too think that black hair looks the best though I also think that blonde could look nice with the look as wellI think blonde goth can be too harsh when it looks like Taylor Momsen. Seeing old pics of Trads, some of them had blonde or brown hair. It was still very much a music focused scene, and I think some punks may have gravitated to goth. Early goth looked punky anyway, so it really doesn't matter it's just a personal preference. If I saw a blonde goth in a club today, I would notice the contrast but I wouldn't judge them for it.
No. 449229
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Just posting some pics of blonde goths. I'm not saying you must have black hair to be goth. You can have whatever color hair or no hair at all.
No. 449230
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No. 449231
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No. 449232
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No. 449237
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I don't know where she got that outfit, but I want it.
No. 449293
>>449154Based
>>449227Hun, GOTHS are PUNKS
And back in the 80s you had much more limited access to hair dye in unnatural colors. We discussed that in old thread.
>>449237That's like the most stereotypical 80s goth outfit
2nd hand wedding dress made out of natural fabrics + a lot of black dye
(unintegrated posting style) No. 449467
>>449227>I wonder if Trads saw us like that, because in the 2000s most of us had red hair. I used to dye mine with Manic Panic Pillarbox Red. Then later on I used Vampire Red because the burgundy went with my Romantic style.AYRT and kek, I didn't dye my hair red but I did do red streaks at one point. Though my style at the time was very casual.
>>449227Well Taylor Momsen isn't a goth and her style doesn't look goth neither, I know she wears a lot of black but whenever I see her, I don't think "goth", I think modern 2010s rock chick but that's just me lol
But the pics you posted with
>>449230 >>449229
>>449230 >>449231
>>449232 I think they all look great lol.
And sure
>>449293 makes a fair point that hair dye in unnatural colors were hard to come by which is why you didn't see many goths dying their hair blues, purples, and greens but I feel like if they were a thing, people in the scene may have gotten burnt out seeing it if it got done to the extent we see them today.
No. 449550
>>449462I'm sorry but the ending was pretty shit. She started off on a banger and declined with But can't we be goth because of the clothing and not the music? (gah!) Tell me she's not a Jake fan because he said the same thing. Then she sort of whinges at us for -rightfully- preserving our subculture.
>How do you expect people to learn if you knock them down when they're just getting startedDon't get into it to be cool. If you start with the music you are less likely to get pushback. We tell them what goth is and they have a meltdown. Poor delicate things.
>Compared to someone like Shego from Kim Possible who's just a dark femme fatale type and Raven who is just a somber magic girl. So she lost me there.I don't know why she bothered to mention them because they aren't goth. She fell into the same mindset that emo is goth. The character wears black, that doesn't automatically equal goth.
>The video didn't even go over OnlyFans women using the scene to play up the fetish that has negatively impacted us actual goths.People like ReeRee and RazorCandi wearing fetish gear and using the hashtag goth makes society think we're whores. My friend was goth and stopped because she was tired of men coming onto her assuming she's into kink. That stuff used to stay in fetish clubs but now it's everywhere. I'll give the video a 5/10. The first part was great, the second part felt like her personal issues with us. But hey, #goth will get you the views, right?
No. 449671
>>449550Ayrt and I'm glad I'm not the only one who came to that comnclusion considering the like/dislike on the ratio. Again, strong start but shat the bed in the second half to the end. I'm not sure if she's a Jake fan but she probably is a fan of
Toxic Tears and Vessel Of Blood type YouTubers, two of the biggest examples of goth posers on Youtube who get a decent amount of views. And probably It's Black Friday wherein she is a real goth but 99% of her content is focused on fashion and makeup and to an outsider who doesn't know much about goth who stumbles across her channel, they would probably think it's about fashion and not about music. Either way, she had some nerve getting pissy when we in the actual scene do take offense to seeing our subculture used as a fashion runway to illicit more social media attention, especially in the recent decade whereas back in the 90s and 00s, we were getting our asses beat or shit thrown at us for being into the scene and back then it really was for genuine interest (for most, I know attention seekers were a thing then as well hence the "mallgoth").
>Don't get into it to be cool. If you start with the music you are less likely to get pushback. We tell them what goth is and they have a meltdown. Poor delicate things.Exactly. While it's true that nowadays it is understandable if one gets into the scene from the fashion, it should be apparent that the scene is really music-based if you actually dig deeper and it's all about listening to the music from there where you won't get much pushback if it's the look that drew you in initially. But if you're doing it just to get likes and follows on your Instagram or TikTok all while treating it like a costume or persona, you shouldn't be surprised when those of us do get irritated.
>I don't know why she bothered to mention them because they aren't goth. She fell into the same mindset that emo is goth. The character wears black, that doesn't automatically equal goth.Exactly. TShe got a point for mentioned Angela from Night of the Demons who is a good example of "goth coded" or that one character from the World Ends who wore a Sisters of Mercy shirt. But no mention of Triana Orpheus or how The Venture Bros was a show created by a goth? I just feel she did a bit of surface level look.
>ReeRee & RazorKandi wearing fetish gear while calling it goth in hashtagsYeah totally. And even before ReeRee became an OnlyFans model, she was a poser in the sense of she was a metalhead who called herself goth because she liked wearing black and was obsessed with horror stuff. RazorKandi, I remember her as a Deathrock model though I never learned if she actually liked goth music (I have a feeling she didn't…). Either way yeah, the fetish crap is annoying and I'm sorry that your friend let it get to her, I had a moment where I considered stopping with goth after getting cross comments from moids as well but I like the music and scene too much to let go so I stayed.
>5/10 ratingYeah I'd give it that too. Would've given her a 10 if she didn't whinge about goths being protective of the subculture from TikTok Zoomer trenders.
No. 449735
>>449676>Did rivetheads go to the BDSM clubs? It was not uncommon to have alt music (industrial, goth) events and BDSM/fetish events in same venues in Europe (as far as I know also in the USA) even with same DJs playing sets at both. It's still a thing at least in some parts here. There are many ties between alt music and fetish scenes on other continents. Fetish party been also a part of Wave Gotik Treffen program for many years.
>>449674Aggrotech has Detroit techno influences due to New Beat ancestry (which was based on mixing pitch shifted EBM tracks with Detroit Techno style bass lines and drums). Topic was disputed in previous thread.
There were times when alt events had mix of many different genres including goa, dark electro, hellectro, agrotech, ebm, futurepop, gothic rock, even metal (there are still nights with mix of metal and gothic rock going that I know of).
No. 449802
>>449777Dammit, I accidentally deleted my post!
>In the last thread an anon shared a video they did of them doing a so called "romantic goth" look and their looks looked nothing like romantic gothI was one of the nonna's complaining about that. I've been into Romantic since the 2000s and her clothes just looked like a cheap costume. Even her dress in the talk show looked gimmicky. I know they like the music but most of their interest seems imaged based, tbh.
>Hearing that Evanescence is the "goth" band that got her into goth kinda says it all. Evanescence aren't a goth band, never have been and are not currently and even Amy Lee herself has stated that she has no interest in the goth sceneShe could've gone with The Cure instead. I know she said it after and that she's answered the question so many times. But normies are gonna to pick out that one thing and think, Yeah heavy eyeliner and black hair is goth.
>I swear it's either people thinking being obsessed with Halloween makes them gawf or being into paganism.For real. She all but promoted that by telling the other host to go out and do the Punk Rock hands, but then told him to do something else. At least they let Connor say goth is a music based subculture. But with the whole interview it doesn't look like it. When they finished with the gendie thing, I was like Great. So what are normies gonna take from that?
1. Halloween does a goth make.
2. Goths are gay.
Why don't those people ask regular goths in the wild, instead of these "influencers" online? We're here, we can tell you instead of these goth cliques speaking for us.
No. 449823
>>449802>I was one of the nonna's complaining about that. I've been into Romantic since the 2000s and her clothes just looked like a cheap costume. Even her dress in the talk show looked gimmickAh hey, yeah, I was conversing with you about it as a fellow fan of romantic goth who got into the look in the late 2000s. You're right, it did look like a cheap costume but she could've made it work if she added the right accessories. Swap out the overdone platform boots (these never read "goth" to me personally) for some pointy toe boots along with some big teased hair, and a rosary and it would've looked more accurate. Her boyfriend was on the better track of mixing in some alternative elements with the bondage looking pants contrasting the waistcoat and poet-style blouse but still, some pointy toe looking boots and a rosary would've made it look more "goth".
Don't get me wrong, I do like the dark romantic look on it's own but if you're trying to make a "romantic goth" look, it really needs to be romantic with goth elements which means taking from certain staples you see in goth fashion that comes from the bands and these two just didn't really pull enough from it but to be fair to them, a lot of people tend to fall into the same mistake of thinking a straight up dark romantic look = romantic goth look.
(For those curious what this was about, vidrel and the outfit showcase starts at 8:53)
>She could've gone with The Cure instead. I know she said it after and that she's answered the question so many times. But normies are gonna to pick out that one thing and think, Yeah heavy eyeliner and black hair is goth.Yeah the distinction must be made, especially on a live TV appearance where it's the chance to get the word out of what the scene really is and if you conflate bands like Evanescence, Marilyn Manson, and/or HIM (and others) while speaking about goth and not making the distinction, you can inadvertently give the wrong impression of what goth actually is.
>Gendie/"Queer" ShitYeah seriously, that stuff can fuck off. Yes there were men and women who were gender nonconforming in the goth scene and it was a lot more welcoming to homosexual people during the 80s but the difference between then and now is that back in the 80s and even the 90s, they didn't make it their whole personality and they weren't denying that they were men and women, you know they actually lived in reality unlike the hopeless gendies today who can't shut up about it. Also it's wild to me how these people think calling homosexual people "queers" is a good thing, it's a deragotary term and the only people I know who think otherwise are non-homosexual people who want to be quirky. Sorry to go off-topic there but hearing him keep saying "queer" this and "queer" that was annoying (what does "queer" mean anyway in these guys' minds? Are you calling gays & lesbians "queers"?)
Connor really should've kept that section brief because yeah, now it's just giving another wrong impression that the scene is about gendie/"queer" bullshit when it isn't.
>Why don't those people ask regular goths in the wild, instead of these "influencers" online? We're here, we can tell you instead of these goth cliques speaking for us.I agree. Why can't these productions just go to a goth club and interview the attendees or scout people there instead of going for random influencers. They did this in the 80s and 90s and with the exception of some stupid things being said, it mostly was kept straight-forward.
No. 449827
>>449809Nah that's totally
valid, I have fondness for Halloween as well. I like the autumn vibes and even though the holiday doesn't feel as exciting as it did when we're kids, that whimsy is still there if ever so faint (just sucks when you have to work on the holiday kek). But yeah it was a great time to get black lipstick and spooky-themed jewelry back in the day but like you mentioned, you can get these things year round now so the rareness is not there anymore but the vibe definitely is.
I just get annoyed when people act like liking the holiday is a sigh that one is goth when like, a lot of people like the holiday just fine and goth doesn't own the holiday as it existed long before goth was even a thing.
No. 449883
>>449671>Either way, she had some nerve getting pissy when we in the actual scene do take offense to seeing our subculture used as a fashion runway to illicit more social media attention, especially in the recent decade whereas back in the 90s and 00s, we were getting our asses beat or shit thrown at us for being into the scene and back then it really was for genuine interestShe did have the nerve to throw a tantrum over that. The link that was posted in the alt threads(sharing vid rel) mentioned the hate we got. Every alt person in the UK knows about Sophie. People were harassed and attacked for being goth. And all for liking the music, so she can fuck off with her attitude. B-b-but we can like the fashion without listening to the music, don't be such an elitist.
Don't wash over the reality that being involved in the scene could've gotten you killed. Even in those times, wearing black would give you problems so Gen Zed making it a fashion statement is insulting.
>RazorCandiShe was a deathrock model and now does OnlyFans porn. I was shocked because one day I was looking for pictures of her and she had her boobs and fanny out. If you're going to do that, don't do it online ffs.
>Either way yeah, the fetish crap is annoying and I'm sorry that your friend let it get to herThe last time I saw her we went to a shop. She told me the man at the till had asked her out. Then he was going on about whips and kink and she said 'I'm just tired of men thinking that's what goth is. They look at you wearing black and assume you're into freaky shit.' It's unfortunate but I guess the men in her town are fairly sheltered or see people like ReeRee and think that's what we are.
No. 449886
File: 1733869231145.jpg (90.11 KB, 736x896, dd816bd85e2027a270dd673a365222…)
>>449823>You're right, it did look like a cheap costume but she could've made it work if she added the right accessories.There are so many examples to make a romantic outfit still look goth. I've seen pics of 80s and 90s romantic that didn't look like a Halloween dress. Again, it's the hair, makeup and accessories that complete the look.
>Yeah the distinction must be made, especially on a live TV appearance where it's the chance to get the word out of what the scene really isReally wish they did that especially since Ireland is super Catholic. They sorta played to the stereotypes so that what normies are gonna remember, unfortunately.
>Yeah seriously, that stuff can fuck off. Yes there were men and women who were gender nonconforming in the goth scene and it was a lot more welcoming to homosexual people during the 80s but the difference between then and now is that back in the 80s and even the 90s, they didn't make it their whole personality and they weren't denying that they were men and womenYes to all of it. They weren't pretending to be asexual aliens. It was just whatever. I mean, the gay dude in our circle hung out with us but he still liked goth and alt music. He knew he was a guy and sometimes he wore lipstick. But he wasn't pretending to be a woman, he wasn't taking over our spaces. He just felt better/safer with a group of us. We didn't care that he was gay, he used to tell us which boys he would kiss. Today, it's ALL about Look At Me I'm Special. It's that mentality plus infiltrating everything and punching people who don't agree. That is not the goth subculture mindset and I don't want it being used to represent us.
>I agree. Why can't these productions just go to a goth club and interview the attendees or scout people there instead of going for random influencersIdk but they should. It's one reason I think Freyja's "documentary" won't work because she's interviewing social media influencers, not everyday people. She might speak to a few random goths, but probably none with less than 20,000 subscribers. The gothic "influencers" are superficial, drama fueled makeup artists that give us a bad name. They are the ones talk shows pick so I'm worried they're fake lifestyle will be the final word on the subculture.
No. 449889
File: 1733869723725.jpg (97.83 KB, 735x716, c83bc78721cc3cc9e46e042a7b0bb6…)
>>449823>Her boyfriend was on the better track of mixing in some alternative elements with the bondage looking pants contrasting the waistcoat and poet-style blouse but still, some pointy toe looking boots and a rosary would've made it look more "goth".Yeah, I forgot to say his look was on point until he added the platform boots. Like we aren't death rockers, lol. If he really wanted to go with classic 80s romantic, some pikes would have complimented the look imho.
No. 449968
File: 1733897441619.png (414.63 KB, 429x565, cover-dim1-3814289389.png)
>>449883>I was shocked because one day I was looking forShe has been doing naked stuff since at least 2013 if no longer. You didn't follow her for quite a while.
There been also other models you know from the '00s scene that had nude sessions. Featured in picrel book did photoshoots for blueblood net
https://www.blueblood.net/2014/11/california-deathrock-book-published/ No. 450167
File: 1733940865362.jpg (32.82 KB, 433x700, tumblr_o01hf22ZD41tlrio8o1_500…)
>>449883Oh I actually watched that vid and I thought it was great! That guy totally nailed the topic and this is why I prefer watching videos like that being made by actual goths who are not zoomers because the latter has to deal with too much conflicting issues and just don't have that "I was there" quality to fight past the misinformation that came after that gen z has no reference to since they just weren't there unfortunately.
Anyway you're right that there's a damn good reason why we are protective and offended when people treat our subculture as a novelty prop for attention just because it's convenient. Sophie Lancaster and this other goth couple (I can't remember their names but they were attacked in a subway back in the 2000s) shows the extent of how far people would go to antagonize us for our harmless interest. Again it's easy for these zoomers to not even think about this stuff since they didn't have to live it but we fucking did and if they had as well, they'd probably understand why this is such an annoying issue that has really dwindled our subculture to a fault.
?RazorCandi doing OnlyFans porn
Oh wow, I'm sad to see she fell into that life but yeah, I can see how she would be playing into that "goth slut" stereotype if she's still portraying herself as a deathrocker (does she still refer to herself as that or goth?)
>The last time I saw her we went to a shop. She told me the man at the till had asked her out. Then he was going on about whips and kink and she said 'I'm just tired of men thinking that's what goth is. Yep a tale as old as time that many of us have had to deal with in some capacity…
>They look at you wearing black and assume you're into freaky shit.' It's unfortunate but I guess the men in her town are fairly sheltered or see people like ReeRee and think that's what we are.Damn, that's really too bad but I hope with time in the future if her interest is still there, she finds her way back to the scene as it'll always be open.
No. 450205
File: 1733942526672.webp (91.73 KB, 900x900, It's_Black_Friday.webp)
>>449886>Yes to all of it. They weren't pretending to be asexual aliens. It was just whatever. I mean, the gay dude in our circle hung out with us but he still liked goth and alt music. He knew he was a guy and sometimes he wore lipstick. But he wasn't pretending to be a woman, he wasn't taking over our spaces. He just felt better/safer with a group of us. We didn't care that he was gay, he used to tell us which boys he would kiss. Today, it's ALL about Look At Me I'm Special. It's that mentality plus infiltrating everything and punching people who don't agree. That is not the goth subculture mindset and I don't want it being used to represent us.It's just so annoying now because so many goths seem to have blindly bought into this crap and even if there are goths who don't believe in the gender ideology nonsense, they'll get ostracized like what happened to that goth YouTuber Kai Decadence when he came out as gender critical. So if you value keeping your social ties within the goth scene, you more or less have to keep quiet about it. Personally I'm not too open about my views but I do sprinkle in kernels of what I believe when the topic comes up and I've been able to skate by that way but sometimes I just want to let lose and spill out all of how I really feel about this misogynistic and homophobic ideology and how it infected the goth subculture with having minds so open their brains are falling out.
>Freya's DocumentaryI had no idea that she was only interviewing influencers, what the fuck is she doing? You're right that influencers do not represent us every day people who are into the subculture, that is such a shallow move and will likely just add in even more dumb stereotypes and misinformation about the reality of goth and how it affects the average individual within the scene.
But to be perfectly honest, Freya has played a part in the bastardization of goth online. I know that she plays the music in her videos which does give some exposure to it as I see some comments left on certain songs of people saying "here because of It's Black Friday" but aside from that, her content is 99% expensive brand hauls and makeup. She never talks about goth music ever and the two times she did talk music, she reviewed a Marilyn Manson album and a Motionless In White album which just gives the impression to uninformed listeners that that stuff also counts as goth because the biggest popular goth youtuber is giving time to them. I wouldn't care as much if she actually reviewed some goth albums and not just focused on these very popular bands that are known to be confused with goth because of the musician's image but she hasn't.
Freya is just such an odd case. Part of me feels that she really is a goth as she really enjoys the music but on the other hand, I can't help but feel like it's all just a means for her to get D-list celebrity status. That it's all just a big show in order for her to get attention.
No. 450209
File: 1733942976596.jpg (101.12 KB, 736x1097, John_Koviak.jpg)
>>449889>Yeah, I forgot to say his look was on point until he added the platform boots. Like we aren't death rockers, lol. If he really wanted to go with classic 80s romantic, some pikes would have complimented the look imho.I just don't understand the obsession with platform boots. Even back in the 90s it was mostly the rivetheads (this includes "cybergoths") were the ones who loved those shoes, most goths seemed to prefer combat boots of pike styles carried from the 80s. Then again, I suppose it is probably because of 2000s deathrock revival influence since a lot of deathrockers at the time loved them some stompy boots which I suppose makes sense since the deathrock look does take on a more imposing look similar to that of what a rivethead look was like (you know, looking tough and all that lol).
Either way it really ruined the look on him and I agree that pikes would've really cemented the look.
No. 450219
Here's another video to add to the chopping block of obnoxius video made by a gen z person (filled with annoying gen z editing style) and another good example of why I don't think a gen z individual could really do a comprehensive history guide without muddling things. When he got the 90s and conflated the "mallgoth" thing as essentially the next form of goth, I knew where this was going. The 90s goth scene had actual goth music, a lot actually but they just weren't as notable to normies in that time since the scene was underground.
And while he was absolutely right about E-Girls and that they aren't listening to actual goth music and just trendy music, I just cannot fathom how anyone can seriously believe that an e-girl looks like a goth. To me, the e-girl style just looked like tumblr fashion but with plaid, platform boots, fishnets, and maybe some slightly edgier makeup but goth looking? How?
But as far as the annoying sexualization that has always been there but I feel like is worse now because of how you now have non-goth women using the goth as a marketing tool to market their Onlyfans or to get attention on TikTok, the biggest reasoning for this is simply just porn culture in general and how it's practically everywhere and you have a whole generation who grew up socialized into it because of how early they accessed social media.
Don't get me wrong, the sexualization was always there but I feel like it's on a whole other level now compared to then because of social media and porn culture clashing together.
>Goth wouldn't be goth without the fishnet tanlines and permanent deformed ribcages (from the corsets)
Disagree. Most goths do not wear corsets and fishnets are not only used in goth fashion. We still have the big hair and just the way we typically accessorize lol.
And then he follows that up with how goth hasn't really evolved in sound unlike punk has, are you serious? Comparing The Danse Society to She Past Away, you can see the evolution of taking the old but tweaking things.
>Sex Sells (when he was talking about how most music-based subcultures are sexualized while featuring sexualized women in those scenes)
No it doesn't. If that is really true than how come we don't see moids splayed out in a sexual manner when they're marketing something like a car or a tool set? Sex does not sell, treating women like objects to be consumed is what "sells". Let's be real here.
No. 450228
>>450209I've seen so many zoomers at goth events mixing classic rivethead elements into otherwise trad goth looks, we'd be having a rivethead revival if zoomers knew the vocabulary for it.
The effect is really strange though, it'll be '80s makeup with '10s drag queen polish to it, goth band tee and patches, rivethead stompy boots, like decades of dark scene archaeology on one person. Everything is a throwback to something in the past but none of it goes together.
No. 450688
>>450219>No it doesn't. Then how do you explain popularity of OF? Both among "models" and consumers?
>If that is really true than how come we don't see moids splayed out in a sexual manner when they're marketing something like a car or a tool set?Because these would be mostly appealing to gay men and not so to straight dudes? How many straight females you know find males in sexual poses appealing enough to watch them in every second ad?
No. 450724
File: 1733997295017.jpg (109.2 KB, 863x356, SLC-Punk-00_07_372022-03-20-15…)
>>450228ot-ish but trying to imagine zoomers attempting to wrap their heads around mod culture kek
No. 450726
>>450724I can't myself wrap my head around mod culture. I get the desire to dress fancy but the scooters part is weird.
BTW nice examples of DIYed decor on leather biker jackets on some rockers from the '60s in this video. 01:27, 01:31 timestamps for example
No. 450881
File: 1734034408850.jpg (187.26 KB, 1027x1405, Sex Sells 08600985-535b-5b6a-a…)
>>450688When I say that the "Sex doesn't sell", I mean that in the most open way possible because who are the ones who usually are overtly sexualized to the point of where they are consumed like objects and not people? Women. I'm pointing out how that term is just a means to justify treating women like sexualized objects that are meant to be consumed or bought. If "sex sells", then you'd be seeing it pushed onto both sexes, not just one overwhelmingly but this discussion is veering away from goth and into radical feminism and I don't want to derail. Just understand that that is why I disagree with that phrase, especially when it's used to justify the fetishization of goth women.
>Because these would be mostly appealing to gay men and not so to straight dudes? How many straight females you know find males in sexual poses appealing enough to watch them in every second ad?There are women who like seeing decently built half naked men. In the emo scene, I remember some girls would go wild when the guys would go topless on stage lol Or in the K-Pop scene where a lot of girls go nuts when the dudes flash their abs or incorporate outftis that showoff their chest and abs.
I don't disagree that you find slightly more women who find men appealing with clothes on then off but I digress.
No. 450888
File: 1734035100252.jpg (36.58 KB, 500x375, Serena.jpg)
>>450228Yeah I think you raise a very good point about why so many zoomer "goth" fashion looks so weird and not flattering, they go on Pinterest and get too inspired by all the different things they see and try to mix them with their "goth" look and it just ends up looking mismatched and not in a flattering way but then other zoomers see that and want to be like them and voila, you see tons of these zoomers having the same kind of mentality when making their outfits and it ends up looking off-putting aside from when they try to do the trad style and the makeup looks too sharp and clean and the clothes too generic from the fast fashion shops.
Like I'm trying to picture what a romantic goth look would look like if the person used platform boots and I just feel like those kinds of boots would just take away from the look because romantic goth relies on bold ornate styling alongside a goth staple so it's already a pretty out there look where you don't want things to overpower and clash.
I was trying to find an example I could look of of someone paring platform boots with a romantic goth look but I couldn't find any and so I just thought back to the character Serena from the adult animated series Downtown as her design seems like it was inspired by the romantic look since that was the look that was popular in the 90s at the time the show came out and they put her in platform boots. In the show it looks fine but it's also because the outfit looks quite casual.
No. 451254
File: 1734061283924.jpg (381.03 KB, 2500x1665, Sadie-Frost-Dracula-web-269968…)
>>450888zoomers grew with low quality modern clothing, quality been declaining in the '00s already especially in the 2nd half.
Most of them have never seen '00s goths in the wild. Just like many millenials "reviving" deathrock back in the '00s have never seen american goths (deathrockers) in the wild back in the '80s. Thats why their looks look so different than the US scene back in the '80s.
Most of zoomers have never been exposed to [printed] fashion magazines with gazillion fashion guides. You remember them? I do, guides on how to mix different elements of wardrobe, how to select clothing for your body type, even tips on formal fashion. Average punk back in the '80s knew much better how normies "shall" dress for formal ocassions than modern average zoomer and even most millenials. Back in the '80s you even had courses on that for young adults in Britain.
They even watch different movies than millenials did. A lot of blockbusters millenials been exposed to were heavy on historic side. Early goth was heavy influenced by horror movies of the '70s and earlier eras. The 90's by stuff like Dracula by Coppola and Interview with the Vampire. Many medieval and 19th century themed TV series and film stuff in general been around.
No. 451442
>>450167>issues and just don't have that "I was there" quality to fight past the misinformation that came after that gen z has no reference to since they just weren't there unfortunately. Yeah, they don't. I know some Zoomers have tried to pull the card that they understand cos they get bullied too. No, honey. You have laws against that. You might get teased but nobody is going to physically hurt you over it. We even had teachers give us shit for being goth, they would lose their jobs if they did it now.
>Again it's easy for these zoomers to not even think about this stuff since they didn't have to live it but we fucking did and if they had as well, they'd probably understand why this is such an annoying issue that has really dwindled our subculture to a fault. I think this needs to be brought up when talking about Millennial goths. Channels focus on the music or clothes but they really need to talk about this. Cyber bullying exists now but Gen Z didn't have kids literally waiting for you behind the school to attack you. Some of those kids got a kick out of harassing the "freak" so when zoomers are like "It's cool to wear black" I'm like Fuck you, zygote! Wearing black wasn't cool in the 2000s. We didn't do it for a fashion statement.
>Damn, that's really too bad but I hope with time in the future if her interest is still there, she finds her way back to the scene as it'll always be open.Yeah, I took a break from everything goth for awhile. When I came back, it was like meeting an old friend. I got into the subculture when I was 15 and it was so comforting to be in it again. I hope she can find that place in her where the music is what's important, not some moid's misconception.
No. 451447
File: 1734094428399.jpg (88.4 KB, 736x981, e02e3aee7a3f010b69e5b062900e00…)
>>450888>Like I'm trying to picture what a romantic goth look would look like if the person used platform boots and I just feel like those kinds of boots would just take away from the look because romantic goth relies on bold ornate styling alongside a goth staple so it's already a pretty out there look where you don't want things to overpower and clash.Found one. You're right, it clashes with the outfit. Its too harsh and doesn't flow. She could have done witch boots or a pointy toe boot to fit the look. My feet are too wide for pointed boots but I found some where the toe is a little narrow and it still works.
>and try to mix them with their "goth" look and it just ends up looking mismatched and not in a flattering way but then other zoomers see that and want to be like them and voila, you see tons of these zoomers having the same kind of mentality when making their outfits and it ends up looking off-puttingIt's like explaining to a Zoomer how to put toppings on a pizza. Then they throw marshmallows and sprinkles on it with chocolate syrup. That's what their style looks like to me.
No. 451452
File: 1734095324063.jpg (83.12 KB, 630x1170, 83deb38c03182b729091ccaf8aed61…)
>>450888If they do witch boots like Dorian's it would make the outfit work. But like I said
>>451447 the way they throw things together and it doesn't have an organic flowing symmetry. I've seen those pics on Pinterest where they slap a bunch of clothes in a collage and call it a set. Then zoomers copy that instead of adding their own thing. Like
>>451254 said, they could use a fashion guide. If you want to do Romantic, go with flowing fabrics, velvets, dark reds and purples, antique or old looking jewelry, pikes, pointed shoes or heels etc.
No. 451466
>>451455Well, very long calf boots in general worn with long skirts or hidden under pants legs are pointless. Long calfs were supposed to protect clothing or be the "show off" part you want to expose not to hide. The only point in wearing platforms with long skirt would be adding few inches to your height but in that case maybe wear skirt that covers platforms totally?
>>451452I'm not sure at this point how many zoomers ever worn anything other than cotton or polyester. Even formal clothing typically made out of wool is losing to polyester and cotton mixes.
No. 451558
File: 1734114192141.jpg (56.6 KB, 425x519, Gothic Beauty 003 (2001)_0000.…)
>>451254I think you might be right. Whenever I listen to those "how I became goth" stories from zoomers, a recurring thing I see aside from the tired old "I was obsessed with Halloween" type answers, they also list how they got into it from cartoon characters and well, most cartoon "goths" are not even goth since they don't reference music but seeing cartoons vs seeing goths in the wild is two different things. But then I've seen some mistake the edgy mallgoths of that time as "goth" as well. Point is, not many of them seemed to have seen actual goths but to be fair to them, as someone who got into goth in 2007 as a junior in high school, I only ever saw one actual goth in my school who was one of the deathrock revival enthusiasts. But unfortunately most alternative people in my school were emos and the emerging scenekids. Me, the deathrocker, and two mallgoths (they wore the Cradle of Filth shirts and TRIPP everything kek) were the only darker alternative people in my school so I can't act like I saw many goths in my personal school life neither.
But I do remember the fashion guides, I specifically remember getting the one picrel. Gothic Beauty Magazine wasn't perfect as it unfortunately mixed in the dark Industrial, "cybergoth", and gothic metal into it but at least in the earlier prints, it still featured some goth bands and that volume specifically did a nice view of the romantic goth style. I learned about Diva Destruction through here and I tried dressing like Debra lol
Zoomers get their inspiration from curated "sets" on Pinterest which are created by other zoomers and they don't have that "lived in" kind of feeling with their looks, it seems like it's all thrown together with no rhyme or reason.
No. 451560
>>451442>Yeah, they don't. I know some Zoomers have tried to pull the card that they understand cos they get bullied too. No, honey. You have laws against that. You might get teased but nobody is going to physically hurt you over it. We even had teachers give us shit for being goth, they would lose their jobs if they did it now.Man the teachers. I remember I had this one guy in my class who would always throw rolled up paper balls at me and my friend with his little group and the teacher would just give an uninterested "stop" and then he just stopped saying anything altogether. Pretty sure he was thinking that we kinda deserved it for dressing in all black. With the exception for the few teachers who did care, most carried an apathetic view of goth and alternative kids.
>I think this needs to be brought up when talking about Millennial goths. Channels focus on the music or clothes but they really need to talk about this. I agree. YouTuber Angela Benedict has actually talked about this a few times in her videos about the bullying her and her friends faced for being goth in the 90s. I've shared a few stories myself but I feel like the bullying I received in the early 2000s was a tad tame compared to my one guy friend who literally got jumped by a group of guys on his way home. I remember he didn't come to school the day after and I went to go check on him and that was when he told me what happened. This happened a few more times until he fought back and got suspended. They stopped messing with him as much after that but I remember finding it so ridiculous that he was the one who got suspended, it was so not fair.
So that's why when I think of what I faced which was usually having paper or rocks thrown at me and being called things like "whore", I feel like he got it worse because at least I didn't get jumped and physically beat on.
>Wearing black wasn't cool in the 2000s. We didn't do it for a fashion statement.For real. I mean, we goths and alternative kids thought black was cool but the overwhelming majority in society certainly didn't think that and would remind you at any turn they could.
>Yeah, I took a break from everything goth for awhile. When I came back, it was like meeting an old friend. I got into the subculture when I was 15 and it was so comforting to be in it again. I hope she can find that place in her where the music is what's important, not some moid's misconception.Very nice. Yeah, it is like meeting an old friend, that's a nice way to put it.
No. 451563
File: 1734115749568.png (653.5 KB, 455x833, LydiaFortner.png)
>>451447Oh good find anon! Yeah that looks pretty bad. It's like it starts out nice enough but then you get to those stompers and it gives you a mental whiplash. Though I feel like the skirt would look better in a black velvety or silky material, the cotton material doesn't really flatter the top half all that much.
But yeah I agree that witch boots or pointy toe boots would really cement the look beautifully.
>It's like explaining to a Zoomer how to put toppings on a pizza. Then they throw marshmallows and sprinkles on it with chocolate syrup. That's what their style looks like to me.Yeah that's definitely an accurate way to put. It's all supposed to be quirky but it's not doing what they think it's doing lol.
No. 451565
>>450205>sometimes I just want to let lose and spill out all of how I really feel about this misogynistic and homophobic ideology and how it infected the goth subculture with having minds so open their brains are falling out.The day will come when we will openly be able to talk about the sheer insanity of this. For now it's religious people who oppose this based on their religion, but there are normal people who are against it for obvious reasons.
>I had no idea that she was only interviewing influencers, what the fuck is she doing? You're right that influencers do not represent us every day people who are into the subculture, that is such a shallow move and will likely just add in even more dumb stereotypes and misinformation about the reality of goth and how it affects the average individual within the scene.She was at WGT this year for her documentary scam. Talking to the fashion influencers including Valentin Van Porcelain and anyone with 100,000 Instagram followers. Like what do they even know of the music, they're in it for the clothes and makeup.
>I see some comments left on certain songs of people saying "here because of It's Black Friday" but aside from that, her content is 99% expensive brand hauls and makeup. That's what pisses me off, is their shallow mindset; it creates misinformation about us(we're just hipsters into makeup) and stereotypes (goths just want to be cool outcasts and refuse to have friends) and that's not true for most of us. They completely turned it upside down. Instead of it being about the music, it's about who's makeup and clothes are better. I don't like how they've created a clique of goth snobs who won't let normies, let alone average goths into their "circle" because we aren't wearing some expensive name brand crap. They've become haute goth assholes with no ties to the actual music scene.
>Freya is just such an odd case. Part of me feels that she really is a goth as she really enjoys the music but on the other hand, I can't help but feel like it's all just a means for her to get D-list celebrity status. That it's all just a big show in order for her to get attention.You got that right. Few people in the real world could afford the lifestyle she has which is funded by her fans. She proudly admits that she's the one who started the Goth Reacts To hashtag on YT. She was into goth but now I think she likes having some fame for being this anti heroine for black sheep. If you boil it down, she's not doing anything positive for the goth community. If anything she's helping create the misinformation that we're railing against.
No. 451566
File: 1734116442326.jpg (109.89 KB, 736x736, 66067622de525e2edb608a6cdf6d3b…)
>>451452>Pinterest clothing guidesI've seen them, like picrel right? lol Even with that collage, I feel like even in picrel, it doesn't really accurately portray the style as it needs more flowy garments on it and at least some witchy style boots or pikes to show that those can help create the look as well. It's true that crushed velvet and velveteen are popular staples in terms of the fabric but flowy elements were also quite popular as well, really brings that sense of whimsy.
Though like you said, the zoomers see image boards like that and run with it and multiply it like crazy imitating these I hate to be blunt but poorly done guides.
No. 451568
File: 1734116639054.jpg (49.06 KB, 379x575, Sam Manson.jpg)
>>451561Unfortunately you're right, aside from them not featuring or referencing goth music, most of them were written poorly as well. I still remember cringing so much when I watched Danny Phantom and heard this quote by Sam kek.
No. 451571
File: 1734117237290.jpg (91.23 KB, 736x795, platforms.jpg)
>>451563>Though I feel like the skirt would look better in a black velvety or silky materialFound one. But she's wearing those platform type boots that really throws off the style. They just fit the cybergoth or Riverhead look instead.
>But yeah I agree that witch boots or pointy toe boots would really cement the look beautifully.Yep. Witch boots with her outfit would look better, I wish someone could give them tips or at least start a Pinterest board of how to mix and match so that it looks symmetrical.
No. 451620
>>451571Oh nice, yeah that skirt looks a lot more flattering but agree, those stomper platform boots just don't work with it and even when you try really hard to think of it as a meeting of elegant and tough, it just doesn't work, at least not for me. Swap those for some pointy toe boots and it's solid.
>Yep. Witch boots with her outfit would look better, I wish someone could give them tips or at least start a Pinterest board of how to mix and match so that it looks symmetrical.Looks like they need some input from the millennials and gen x'ers to help fill them in on how it's truly done.
No. 452022
File: 1734187622240.jpg (27.42 KB, 359x550, c0bd6950ebbb7e2d316f348dc233ee…)
>>451566Those are the sets I see on Pinterest that claim to be Romantic. What does a bug in resin have to do with romantic? And yeah, velvets are good but maybe a flowy duster or shawl would compliment the look. Or some antique jewelry, or vintage looking rosary. What passes for romantic these days is way off the mark. I wouldn't call it romantic, either.
No. 452024
File: 1734188403688.jpg (175.02 KB, 750x1125, 531530s.jpg)
>>451620>and even when you try really hard to think of it as a meeting of elegant and tough, it just doesn't work, at least not for me.Me either. Romantic isn't tough, I think that's why it doesn't work. Some goths in the 2000s wore chunky heel boots but they weren't platforms.
>Swap those for some pointy toe boots and it's solid.Even if they are a little narrow at the toe like picrel, it would still work. I think Zoomers just don't get how to put something together.
>Looks like they need some input from the millennials and gen x'ers to help fill them in on how it's truly done.I'm happy to help with that. Pinterest is mostly packed with ideas like
>>451566 and they need a board with examples of how to style a Romantic wardrobe.
No. 452025
File: 1734189239626.jpg (48.88 KB, 1280x720, Taratheandroid.jpg)
>>451858Kek, it sounds like a robot. This is unfortunate. The whole point of goth is DIY and to have the AI do it is like wearing 3D printed clothes.
No. 452028
File: 1734190086048.jpg (15.22 KB, 600x400, Sensatiano-DL12-1_min600.jpg)
>>452024>Even if they are a little narrow at the toe like picrel, it would still work. I think Zoomers just don't get how to put something together.Many don't even look outside "goff brands" for shoes. Picrel is popular design of folk dancing shoes in many European countries. In central Europe there are dozens of manufacturers handmaking them, I have seen them worn by goths like ummm… I can't even remember such case since times when neovictorian was all the rage 15 years ago. Handmade and designed to dance in them which means they have some quality to them. They are typically like 110 Euro for a new pair. Many "alt brands" cost more for lower quality.
No. 452030
File: 1734190569039.png (56.27 KB, 300x300, buty-kankan.png)
Cancan boots are made in even wider selection of European countries
No. 452033
File: 1734190958727.png (148.71 KB, 900x900, german_cancan_boots.png)
>>452030some example from German shop
No. 452042
>>452033I wear this style of shoes almost every day (mine have a taller heel and rise higher on the calf though) and people always love them. They’re so versatile and go with basically everything.
>>451558>Zoomers get their inspiration from curated "sets" on Pinterest which are created by other zoomers and they don't have that "lived in" kind of feeling with their looks, it seems like it's all thrown together with no rhyme or reason.This is how I feel about so much stuff these days but particularly in certain “alternative” subcultures. It’s just like a set costume that gets put on now by anyone who wants to buy it, it isn’t unusual, and the culture in young people’s internet spheres is actually to push each other into little boxes of the way you can do it. You’re not a “real goth” unless you wear some new ultra-refined rendition of 90s drag-inspired makeup, which most goths never worse. Stuff like that. I’ve also noticed that because of the lack of real-world social spaces, there’s this defensive need to constantly prove they’re really part of the “culture” by rattling off musical facts. When you go to goth shows there will be elders in black turtlenecks and trench coats and random funky black clothes just chilling, a bunch of millennials decked out in the most impressive stuff possible, and zoomers very loudly proclaiming that they study the history of goth albums every day on discord and know everything about the music and bla bla bla. Counterculture spheres did used to be gatekeepy but the pressure often felt like it was on you being organically part of things, like metalheads wanting indications that you actually regularly attend shows by different bands. Somehow the new attitudes also seem paired with the general Puritanism zoomers have too. You’re not really supposed to be daring or disturbing or to do anything shocking that makes people question their worldview. The whole sense that goth truly surprised and challenged and disturbed people’s religions and cultural norms and assumptions isn’t there, it’s just like, put on certain makeup and know a list of bands and you’ll be cool and meme-riddled guys will all find you sexy.
That said, obviously I still know plenty of older goths with fairly thriving organic local scenes who have clear personal styles and real artistic expression and who engage with the subculture very meaningfully, and I do think all of that is possible for younger goths to get into, but social media reliance is essentially a problem.
No. 452049
>>452046Kek yeah. I still have a bunch of older metalhead friends and it’s very clear they think you actually have to actively put in effort and show that you’re passionate and not just posturing for appearance points. On one hand it used to go way too far and occasionally still can, but on the other hand I honestly agree that subcultures should be about actual cultural engagement and interaction, and a very internal personal thing, and not about achieving the result of having people think you’re cool and different by slapping on a costume.
I think some people are finding a good balance in the goth scene by being actively welcoming to baby bats and helping guide them but also making it clear it’s not about buying an elaborate outfit and then walking around bragging about your goth cred, and it is about wanting to engage with the art and people because they mean something to you, exploring your local scene, bands and shows, and bringing your own genuine self into it. All of that is ultimately a lot more fulfilling and makes people stick around too.
No. 452636
File: 1734260215973.jpg (66.79 KB, 1000x1000, 1117290.jpg)
>>452227I have wide feet and can't wear pointed toe boots. But you can find boots/shoes made for wide feet and it might help. I can wear shoes that are a little narrow at the toe but pikes are a no go.
https://www.pavers.co.uk/products/buckle-detail-ankle-boots-willa-324-177/Black/4https://www.debenhams.com/categories/womens-shoes-boots-wide-fit No. 452662
>>452636That's more of an issue of width of typical shoe in store than shape of toe. There are ways to circumvent the issue in custom made shoes. But that's a more expensive solution.
There is of course no obligation to wear spear pointed or in any way pointed toe too. It's just a shape that been popular back in the '80s and few other periods.
No. 453186
>>451560>Man the teachers. I remember I had this one guy in my class who would always throw rolled up paper balls at me and my friend with his little group and the teacher would just give an uninterested "stop" and then he just stopped saying anything altogether.We used to live in a shot area and the teachers clearly didn't care about us or what we did. Then we moved to a nicer area and the teacher at that school gave me hell. That old bat sent me to the principals office because my makeup was "distracting" the class. That was major bullshit, she had her own ideas about kids wearing black and made problems for me. So before going to her class I had to wipe off my black lipstick. And because you could only get black lipstick during Halloween, I had to start using a different color. I failed her class and I didn't care. People think it's only kids bullying you, but they forget about the teachers who do it, too.
>They stopped messing with him as much after that but I remember finding it so ridiculous that he was the one who got suspended, it was so not fair.That's always how it goes. I'm sure the school saw black clothes and thought Delinquent. Some of us used to encourage the Satanist stereotype, because people were more scared of that. If they thought you'd axe murder them, they left you alone. It sucks to do that but it's better than getting you ass jumped. The goth dude in our group got called "faggot" several times for wearing black lipstick. Those times were brutal for the nonconforming, man.
>So that's why when I think of what I faced which was usually having paper or rocks thrown at me and being called things like "whore", I feel like he got it worse because at least I didn't get jumped and physically beat on.Yeah, to be a young Millennial meant having a thicker skin. If you couldn't handle insults you wouldn't make it through school. Whatever, they probably have boring lives compared to ours.
>For real. I mean, we goths and alternative kids thought black was cool but the overwhelming majority in society certainly didn't think that and would remind you at any turn they could.Oh, yeah. That teacher who narked on me for wearing black lipstick? She made a point of wearing a big gold cross necklace just so I could see it. I guess she thought it would scare me. Back then, during lunchtime the teachers had lunch at the same time as the students. When she sat at the teachers table I used to give her the death stare. And she would purposefully look my way and whisper to the other teachers about me. I'm just surprised when Zoomers think wearing black is cool. Wearing black then would give people permission to air their opinions about your soul without asking you if you wanted to hear it. It's so weird that goth is a fashion statement now.
No. 454715
File: 1734563218631.webp (170.69 KB, 1280x1280, 1p83o83o8.png)
I'd love to see some inspo for goth winter outfits! Discuss fave pieces, tips, etc
No. 455468
File: 1734641353537.jpg (48.56 KB, 736x736, e23baa75fbc80a8f4fd98003eb7da3…)
>>454715You got it. Incoming photo dump!
No. 455489
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No. 455493
File: 1734642448939.jpg (36.12 KB, 600x600, 76a0f182b43b8b4a2dd101fe4862b7…)
No. 455496
File: 1734642476418.jpg (37.61 KB, 429x625, fa1c69d186d09d17092814f3b03903…)
No. 455498
File: 1734642541320.jpg (39.07 KB, 600x600, 55e75c906d895118d0622ee53b5693…)
No. 455499
File: 1734642605109.jpg (38.85 KB, 483x599, 5c5a4446b82ef34306e4bf956c1399…)
No. 455501
File: 1734642636643.jpg (61.37 KB, 640x763, 963b7b4e8ef7c1aaceff8331897ae3…)
No. 455507
File: 1734642944425.jpg (128.91 KB, 1080x1080, 926b49589989ca79410adfcdb9111d…)
>>454715Cool looking coats.
No. 455538
File: 1734644831518.jpg (261.57 KB, 794x1059, il_794xN.4724150555_m1bu.jpg)
>>454715Layers are key. Knee high socks in cotton or wool
Leg warmers/arm warmers
Fingerless gloves(short or long)
Scarves, snoods, ski masks
Thermal shirts or pants
Velvets and velour
Mix and match so you don't look like a marshmallow(don't wear 3 shirts, a sweater, scarf and hoodie at the same time)
Warm leggings or wear long socks with short socks on top
Wool skirts, jumpers or vests
If you don't want to wear thermal pants or warm leggings, try cotton tights and calf length boots
Hats, wool head wraps or scarves(picrel)
Coats, wool capes, leather jackets, or trenchcoats
Minimal or small jewelry that won't snag on your headscarf/coat
I don't wear face powder or foundation since it will rub off on said scarves or jacket. I play up my eyes with dark red or purple eyeshadow and blend to give the slightly dead look
Waterproof eyeliner, mascara and all day wear lipstick are my staples.
No. 455550
File: 1734646593960.png (1.73 MB, 1000x1616, R.png)
Layers
No. 455561
File: 1734647294925.jpg (328.72 KB, 1280x1920, 8235a19c2e05a318d54acc28539ab5…)
No. 455562
File: 1734647327083.jpg (48.81 KB, 1024x1024, punk-rave-men-s-gothic-asymmet…)
No. 455566
File: 1734647552088.jpg (57.55 KB, 474x808, 85b33c88e8c0ffddee7c0368b8b3fe…)
Kind of woodland witch, but it works for winter.
A surprise month of Hellmas is now in effect. For the rest of the month of December, VPN posting will be banned.