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Well the pink pill thread has an anon dropping pages from Why Does he Do That by Lindy Bancroft which is about recognizing and avoiding abhsive men. Maybe getting the book is a good place to start so you can at least avoid the worst of men. I don't think that anon will post the whole book.
I disagree with the phrasing of 'where have all the good men gone' though because it implies there was a plentitude of good men once that doesn exist now. It's probably always been the same, just bad in different ways.
Pay attention to >how he behaves when he's wrong about something>how he acts when he's physically stressed (hurt/sick/tired/hungry)>how he treats you when you're sick or feeling unwell>how he treats people that he could be a dick to without consequences (ie. service workers)>how he reacts when you express a boundary>how he treats animals
A good partner is different for everyone, but generally you want someone who is patient, respectful, kind, and considerate. If you can find someone you don't mind being stuck in traffic with, that's good. If you feel like you can share what's on your mind and be heard and understood, that's good. If one thing going wrong isn't a big deal, that's good.
My fiancé was always a decent man and a great human being in general but when we met he had tons of issues. He was depressed, unable to fight/take criticism, had difficulties to express his emotions and to communicate in general. He was just like a lot of men I knew back then. But you know what made the difference? He tried everything to be better when he met me and realized that he truly loves me. (cheesy, I know lol) We’ve been living together for 3 years now and he’s a different man now. My fiancé definitely is an intellectual introvert, he’s very aware of other man being horrible and has always been on the softer side. He’s never loud, he doesn’t care about drugs/drinking/parties and he is extremely loyal. I never had to worry about him and other women from the start although he has a lot of female friends and looks pretty hot. After we dated for a year he started doing therapy which honestly changed so much for us. When I look at other people’s relationships and other women’s boyfriends I’m in shock. We never fight, we simply discuss our issues, solve them and move on. We always try to improve and be better for ourselves and each other, we live together and he takes care of the house, walks the dog, works very hard, just like I do. We take care of each other, he makes me feel secure and I’m very excited to start a family with him because he’ll be a great dad. It wasn’t easy but I always knew it was worth it because he made me feel loved and special from the very beginning. We’re each other’s best friends and talk about everything, he knows me like no one else does and I honestly never met a better person. I love him with my whole heart and I know that he feels the same about me.
If you meet a man with issues that are not horrible (excluding everything abusive, drugs/drinking, treating women shitty in general, being completely emotionally unavailable etc.) it’s sometimes worth to try and fix them, especially when you’re both young. No body is perfect and I sure as hell was not when I met my partner. We both grew in the process of becoming better but I know I pushed and supported him more because in the end women will be the ones to be way more self aware. It’s fine I guess, because now he’s just amazing.
Just be sure you want to grow up together. It's no use if you try to fix other men and don't grow up yourself, listening and working together towards a common goal.
You're not a therapist, you shall be a life companion.
This. It definitely can work if it’s not only you fixing him but fixing yourself in the process. I was pretty shitty myself when we met because i had quite toxic
relationships before so I was deeply insecure, jealous, scared and impulsive as fuck. I’ve always been semi-aware of these issues but I could only start working on my shit because I realized that I hurt someone I really love with my behavior. It was basically the same reason for my fiancé. I understand that this doesn’t always work out because I had former relationships where I tried to save my partner and they turned out like shit. (I got a type…) but deep inside I always knew they weren’t worth it - I still tried and failed. With my partner now it was just different from the start because he really tried and so did I. Giving up on us was just not an option. I’m the first person to tell my friends to leave a shitty man because most of them are trash, but there are decent men and sometimes they need some time to develop into an even better person.
I recently had that happen to me. For almost 3 years I was fixing him. He went from a depressed suicidal skelly, to muscular, more confident and got a job. 1 month into him having a job and he dumps me. He has immediately moved on and feels like he is better than me. I was his life companion, but a new younger girl who doesn't talk about adult topics is a lot more interesting and fun.
And he portrayed himself as a moral and ethical man: anti-pornography, not a misogynist, vegan, etc. In the end he ended up being a coward who didn't have the balls to break up with me.
The whole 'fixing you partner' phrase is kinda messed up. You have to ask yourself whether you'd stay with them even if they can't be 'fixed'
Most issues need to be solved internally so nobody can fix another person and nobody wants to be viewed as a fixer upper, it's condescending. I had an ex talk like that about my anxiety issues and after three years he left me for another woman with an anxiety disorder (oh and his ex before me had an anxiety disorder) Fixing people shouldn't be anyones goal, it creates a weird dynamic in a relationship
this is terrifying because you're describing my current partner literally exactly. the only difference is he's still skelly lol
but that is the focus rn helping him eat better. we're coming up to three years together and everything seems perfect we've never once fought but I am already scared of this happening.
That’s why I usually go after men who already have desirable traits and don’t need to be formed and molded with my guidance.
From my own experience, men who have their own intrinsic motivation to improve themselves in every way possible are very rare. I like going after the quiet intellectual bookish types that rarely use the internet, heck, maybe are even a little technophobic. If he reads nonfiction books and builds his own ideas instead of parroting what other people say on the internet, he’s already built himself up and improved himself mentally. Bonus if he works out and is very conscious about his health, hygiene and appearance (but not to the point of vanity). A man that’s competitive with himself instead of others— especially other men— shows he doesn’t compare himself and isn’t envious, which is one of the worst traits to have. It’s such a downer when men have to prove that they’re better than their rich boss, womanizing friend or hotter brother. Like calm down and just be happy with yourself.
I am also scared of this happening to me… Even though everything is great, he isn’t like the typical misogynistic fuckboi, but I do encourage him to eat better, use skin care, get a better job, dress better, etc. I am SO scared that once he “levels up” in his mind, will he leave me for another chick?
He says he won’t plus he has crappy social skills so I doubt any chick besides me is checking for him, but that’s how it is now. People change all the time, and the ones that say they won’t ever change, change the most.
I’m completely dependent on him, I’ve moved far away from my family and friends, my life revolves around his and vice versa. Sage for blogpost.
The idea of not helping him because you're scared of him leaving is fucked behavior though. It's almost like guys from the past who kept their women illiterate or modern men who ration what financial support they give their wives and make her hide her sexuality outside of the home because they don't want her getting ideas of independence.
I don't think it's in any way women's responsibility to teach men to become decent humans, don't get me wrong, but I think making the conscious effort to hold someone back or stifle them is toxic
. Codependency breeds jealousy and bitterness.
>>120777>I’m completely dependent on him, I’ve moved far away from my family and friends, my life revolves around his and vice versa
That should be concerning you a lot right now
, let alone anything that might happen in the future. That type of social/geographic isolation is crucial to many unhealthy relationships, you see it a lot
relationships and plain ol' simply unhappy relationships. If he starts making a lot more money don't be surprised if he starts acting resentful.
Focus on making new friends and establishing a new social network and finding employment or new educational opportunities. If he ends up being a jerk 4 years from now due to a brain injury or whatever you'll have the means to leave him. If he never changes for the worst you still have more money, more education or more friends from the efforts you could be making now.
Describing yourself as completely dependent on him is worrying, your concerns about other women as competition isn't healthy either. Being in a dynamic where you don't have friends/family nearby and you say your life revolves around him.. that doesn't give you alot of freedom to just walk away if things go badly. And it doesn't help you to see things clearly if you have him up on a 'he's my everything' pedestal
Every sentence in your post was basically a red flag for unhealthy relationships
Listen, sis, a good man is one who lacks all these attributes, but inconveniently extremely difficult to find:
- Conservatism, porn-sickness, "Liberal feminism", "haha jokes about women are funny", geeks, /poltards / reddards, SJW-ridden Chad, Chauvanists, rapists, degenerates, hipster, "I have no personality," "I care more for my dog over you," abusiv cunts, narcissists, "Sips tea let's debate rationally about this," "What's wrong with the deepfakes?", "Idk that's pretty funny lol," "Hey Mom - I mean - Lena!", Inserts emotional sob story here, and others
You're hard-pressed, basically.
I think you are misunderstanding what people have said. In short, you shouldn't date someone you view as a project from the outset, you shouldn't be aiming to change people. Either he doesn't change and you waste your time or he does change and there is a higher likelihood of him leaving you. You should date a person who you are happy with from the start. And the support you give you can't just give out blindly or give out too much. You should not be sacrificing yourself to support and uplift a man. Only give things you would happily give
even if you get nothing back. This applies for all relationships. You can give expecting something in return, even something as modest as appreciation and never get it and this is very common.
Oh, same on that last sentence. Sometimes it scares me half to death realising the situation I‘m in. How he could have a change of heart or issues could come up and I‘m out on my ass. I‘ve been in the situation where I‘d have considered breaking up due to a mismatch of principles, but then I think…"but then where would I go? What would I do?" and so try work through it. I insisted he get therapy because I think some of his viewpoints that we clash on stem from low self esteem. I was also initially threatened by any new woman coming into his life, usually coworker. An attractive woman, with a job, in his field, same passions and speaks his native language?
But sitting, waiting, worrying is no good. I‘m trying to learn the language and I‘m applying for jobs. I‘m hoping his therapy, and my eventually establishing myself and a social network here will smooth out a lot of the base insecurities.
Shit, what a blogpost.
>What makes a good man?
A good upbringing usually. A lot of good female role models, taught to do his share and treat everyone equally, be kind and generous. Not put women on a pedestal, not look down on them or assume characteristics based on gender. Healthy respectful relationship between parents.
>How do I find one?
I lucked out finding mine at a meetup. Usually I find better quality, more wholesome men when I go to some hobby event alone. Hiking, cycling, or going to some nice event, group picnic or seeing some free concert, though more lecherous men go to the drinking based events, so I‘d steer clear of those. Usually they look like they probably already have a steady relationship, in the way they don‘t act differently or more tense around women, because they‘re secure in where they‘re at.
>What are his characteristics?
They have integrity, established morals, their friends are nice, and their friend group includes women without the dynamic being weird or flirtatious. Nice to their mum (within reason), happy to see others succeed and generally genuinely positive. Has a can-do attitude through the bad times. I‘ve often found they lack the average sense of humor though.
There isn't really a specific group of men that doesn't have shitty men, but it's best to avoid alt-right ones, males who fetishize certain races of women, fat or skinny women, scat, etc. Obviously most fetishizists despite what they are, are repulsive and red flags, but some can be pretty level headed about it if it's something simple like stockings, heels, whatever
Some men will hide red flags well but you can tell red flags by the way they speak, calling women females regularly, using the words alpha and beta male unironically, randomly bashing harmless groups of women for no reason, etc.
Gamer males are usually absolute cancer especially if they're porn sick, I guess the closest to a group where most decent men are is groups of men who focus soley on their hobbies like artists, writers, cooks, etc. Nothing wrong with men who like nerdy stuff, in fact I kinda prefer it, but if he never leaves his league and twitch it raises red flags for me, especially if they come off as lazy homebodies
>Characteristics of a good man
Isn't hung up over exes, knows how to be respectful and what's appropriate and what's not appropriate, patient, not abusive, not fast to assume crazy shit, doesn't play mind games, typical stuff. Sadly women are so use to men playing games that men NOT doing such is seen as a saint.
Prioritizes you, understands mutual feelings are important, doesn't talk disrespectfully of you behind your back, doesn't pull any of the "haha girlfriend bad" shit, doesn't beg for you to spend time with him just to act disinterested, doesn't make fun of you or make you feel insecure. Again typical stuff that men sadly do so often that men not doing this is seen as amazing. Not jumping to crazy conclusions like "she hasn't answered me in 3 minutes she must be cheating, she asked me to pick up a 2 dollar snack from the gas station she must be a gold digger, etc"
As for characteristics they can do, putting actual emotional effort into the relationship, take decent care of their hygiene and themselves, acts like a boyfriend pretty much, is willing to have a deep emotional connection with you and goes into deep conversations, is willing to be open pretty much, likes physical affection, is comfortable but not too comfortable, like doesn't through a fit over if you burp or something while you two or alone but also doesn't fart up a storm when visiting family.is actually willing to go places and do things, unlike men in 2019 who's ideas of romance are just 11 PM hookups. Buying things, clearly isn't required depending on the man's situation of course but sometimes a rose and chocolates show you care or even just hand written letters and stuff can just show you care.
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Only in 2d.
porn, 4chan (depending on a few factors), talks about being attracted to celebrities. it's disrespectful. a guy needs to have a GOAT tier, perfect, like, "he actually has a halo" personality for me to want to date. this guy sounds okay, i can see the appeal for people without like "unrealistic" and exacting standards. none of this shit makes him "the best" tho, imo.
i know a number of guys i think are alright people, but are not relationship quality.
Somehow I didn't see the celeb thing. That is certainly disrespectful. That combined with the porn is gross. I hate how it's acceptable behavior.
Other than that it seems like he really loves and cares about her. It's easy for us to look at things like a checklist but I'm sure he's actually a good guy and makes her feel loved.>>121095
Some guys will stop of their own volition if they are in a relationship. It's rare but they are out there.
Maybe I'm in the minority but as woman I wouldn't want a guy telling me to stop watching porn , I obvs don't mind whether they do either
Is porn a hard limit for most?
I don't watch porn but I don't care if my boyfriend does, as long as it's not fetish hardcore porn.
I think my boyfriend stopped watching porn since we are together tho.>>121093>>121099
Do you not find some celebrities attractive?
Yeah I have a couple of fave male porn stars, both pretty hung, guys get just as intimidated/jealous as women
I get that some porn habits are unhealthy if it's dodgy porn or if it's an addiction but I believe that most of the time people only care so much because of jealousy. Like how dare you find another man/woman attractive